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Articles like this are almost enough motivation to start a movement that I would call Technologists Against Academia. The premise is that since technologists ar

Articles like this are almost enough motivation to start a movement that I would call Technologists Against Academia. The premise is that since technologists are generally second-class citizens in academia, they should not support the work and unattainable careers of its first class citizens.

_delirium 13y ago
In what sense are technologists second-class citizens in academia? Anything to do with computing is the best part of academia to be in at the moment, from compilers to systems to machine learning to AI. Relatively high salaries, more funding than just about anywhere except physics and medicine, good consulting prospects if you want to do that in addition to or instead of academia, quite a few faculty openings if that's your thing, many full-time researchy industry jobs if that's your thing, etc.
- ChristianMarks 13y ago
  My reply is elsewhere on this site: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6701769 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6701769 EDIT: I cannot reply inline to dinkumthinkum's naive mischaracterization of my remarks, and the unhelpful and the misleading question he asks, but my remarks were certainly not confined to "IT admin stuff." They included scientific programming and substantive intellectual contributions to published research. Of course "IT admin stuff" isn't that valued in industry--one of the points was that it is even less so in academia, which is a strong reason to avoid doing it. It is an occupational hazard to take a research position only to be steered into it when one's superiors cannot or choose not to distinguish between "IT admin stuff," scientific programming and substantive contribution to published research.
  - dinkumthinkum 13y ago
    That response to me is very naive. Do you really think IT admin stuff is really so valued in industry? ... wow I have news for you ... I almost taken aback by this.
Fomite 13y ago
Everywhere I've been, good technologists - right alongside good lab managers - are universally well regarded, and many professors I know will insulate their techs jobs from the vagaries of grant funding as best they can. And when labs do hit rocky periods, its usually the techs they worry about the most.
- ChristianMarks 13y ago
  This has not been my experience.
- cryoshon 13y ago
  Being "well regarded" doesn't pay rent. As a technologist in academia, my largest complaint is that the money is maybe 40% of industry rate. Sure, if you're good, you get some kind of respect, but respect sans doctorate still won't let you join the "academic" caste as far as the PhDs who tell you what to do are concerned. If you're good, you're considered to be akin to an especially fast and vigorous race horse, not a skilled jockey.
  - ChristianMarks 13y ago
    Even respect with a doctorate might not cut it.
analog31 13y ago
An impressive number of Nobel Prizes in Physics are awarded for technologies.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]

_delirium 13y ago

In what sense are technologists second-class citizens in academia? Anything to do with computing is the best part of academia to be in at the moment, from compilers to systems to machine learning to AI. Relatively high salaries, more funding than just about anywhere except physics and medicine, good consulting prospects if you want to do that in addition to or instead of academia, quite a few faculty openings if that's your thing, many full-time researchy industry jobs if that's your thing, etc.

ChristianMarks 13y ago
My reply is elsewhere on this site: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6701769 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6701769 EDIT: I cannot reply inline to dinkumthinkum's naive mischaracterization of my remarks, and the unhelpful and the misleading question he asks, but my remarks were certainly not confined to "IT admin stuff." They included scientific programming and substantive intellectual contributions to published research. Of course "IT admin stuff" isn't that valued in industry--one of the points was that it is even less so in academia, which is a strong reason to avoid doing it. It is an occupational hazard to take a research position only to be steered into it when one's superiors cannot or choose not to distinguish between "IT admin stuff," scientific programming and substantive contribution to published research.
- dinkumthinkum 13y ago
  That response to me is very naive. Do you really think IT admin stuff is really so valued in industry? ... wow I have news for you ... I almost taken aback by this.

Fomite 13y ago

Everywhere I've been, good technologists - right alongside good lab managers - are universally well regarded, and many professors I know will insulate their techs jobs from the vagaries of grant funding as best they can. And when labs do hit rocky periods, its usually the techs they worry about the most.

ChristianMarks 13y ago
This has not been my experience.
cryoshon 13y ago
Being "well regarded" doesn't pay rent. As a technologist in academia, my largest complaint is that the money is maybe 40% of industry rate. Sure, if you're good, you get some kind of respect, but respect sans doctorate still won't let you join the "academic" caste as far as the PhDs who tell you what to do are concerned. If you're good, you're considered to be akin to an especially fast and vigorous race horse, not a skilled jockey.
- ChristianMarks 13y ago
  Even respect with a doctorate might not cut it.

analog31 13y ago

An impressive number of Nobel Prizes in Physics are awarded for technologies.

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]