5 ms·

And I have a problem with calling this racism. Bias != racism To me, racism is hatred toward a person or persons because of their race, the desire to cause pa

And I have a problem with calling this racism. Bias != racism To me, racism is hatred toward a person or persons because of their race, the desire to cause pain or suffering to a group of people because of their race, or actively trying to rid the world of a race of people. All humans are biased to some degree or another. And we are all biased for different reasons. If I am hiring people, there's a strong likelihood that I am going to be biased about who I hire based on where they grew up, where they went to school, what ethnicity they are, what gender they are, what race they are, simply because I am human. These do not equate to hatred which I think is what racism is about. Eqaulity is a noble objective in some ways but ridding the world of human bias is not going to happen.

owenmarshall 13y ago
Your definition forces a very limited view to what racism is - so limited that it serves to minimize the harmful effects of racism that are still present in the world, so limited that it serves only to describe the ugliest of individuals in the world, and so limited that it's practically worthless in conversation.
- frogpelt 13y ago
  By all means, enlighten me. What is racism then if it's not based on hatred of people because of their race?
  - aaronblohowiak 13y ago
    Racism is any bias based on race.
    - cglace 13y ago
      If I'm white and I have a bias to think that white people typically can't dance. Does that make me a racist?
    - derefr 13y ago
      Oddly enough, this implies something HN people might find enlightening: Bayesian inference--you know, the mathematically-correct way to update a model of the world based on information--is inherently racist. (And sexist, and a bunch of other -ists.) (If people don't get the joke, this is a bit like the statement "science is inherently leftist." That doesn't mean science is wrong; it means you should re-evaluate your opinion (and moral gut-reaction) of exactly what it means to be leftist. Or, in this case, racist or sexist.)
      - owenmarshall 13y ago
        This is a perfect example of what my statistics professor always warned us about: if you base your statistics on a terrible model, you'll end up drawing terrible conclusions!
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
sophacles 13y ago
Googling "define racism" results in: the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races. It isn't about hatred. A bias towards hiring people of one race (or against hiring people of a race) fits in this, because the only reason to have that bias is that members of that race don't have the right characteristics or abilities. Example: "Company doesn't hire black people because they wouldn't be a culture fit" assumes all black people have the characteristic: culture mismatch. Hidden bias is still bias: People with "black" names don't get called, and a commonly cited reason is "that name sounds ignorant" (as if a person chooses their own name). And back it up with "well if they care, they would call themselves something normal, like mike". Biases about race can exist in a person, but that doesn't mean you have to act on them. It doesn't mean you can't recognize them, evaluate them, and if they make no sense, work to discard them. Having biases may be human, but so is the ability to introspect and to change biases.
- rfnslyr 13y ago
  Then I'm a racist. Sue me.
  - codygman 13y ago
    That's alright most non-poc people, even those that try not to be, are racist because society pushes you towards it constantly. Instead I'll point you here: http://racismschool.tumblr.com/ http://racismschool.tumblr.com/ If you need any help, feel free to message me personally via the email in my profile.
    - rfnslyr 13y ago
      Is it racist to identify cultural differences and strengths and make decisions based off those? For example: I'd much rather hire a Russian programmer than a Chinese programmer simply because I can communicate with the Russian better, we're from similar cultural backgrounds, and I understand where he is from. Is that racist? To pretend that differences don't appear in all types of people is ignorant in itself.
codygman 13y ago
No, this is plain ol' institutionalized racism.

owenmarshall 13y ago

Your definition forces a very limited view to what racism is - so limited that it serves to minimize the harmful effects of racism that are still present in the world, so limited that it serves only to describe the ugliest of individuals in the world, and so limited that it's practically worthless in conversation.

frogpelt 13y ago
By all means, enlighten me. What is racism then if it's not based on hatred of people because of their race?
- aaronblohowiak 13y ago
  Racism is any bias based on race.
  - cglace 13y ago
    If I'm white and I have a bias to think that white people typically can't dance. Does that make me a racist?
  - derefr 13y ago
    Oddly enough, this implies something HN people might find enlightening: Bayesian inference--you know, the mathematically-correct way to update a model of the world based on information--is inherently racist. (And sexist, and a bunch of other -ists.) (If people don't get the joke, this is a bit like the statement "science is inherently leftist." That doesn't mean science is wrong; it means you should re-evaluate your opinion (and moral gut-reaction) of exactly what it means to be leftist. Or, in this case, racist or sexist.)
    - owenmarshall 13y ago
      This is a perfect example of what my statistics professor always warned us about: if you base your statistics on a terrible model, you'll end up drawing terrible conclusions!
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]

sophacles 13y ago

Googling "define racism" results in: the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races. It isn't about hatred. A bias towards hiring people of one race (or against hiring people of a race) fits in this, because the only reason to have that bias is that members of that race don't have the right characteristics or abilities. Example: "Company doesn't hire black people because they wouldn't be a culture fit" assumes all black people have the characteristic: culture mismatch. Hidden bias is still bias: People with "black" names don't get called, and a commonly cited reason is "that name sounds ignorant" (as if a person chooses their own name). And back it up with "well if they care, they would call themselves something normal, like mike". Biases about race can exist in a person, but that doesn't mean you have to act on them. It doesn't mean you can't recognize them, evaluate them, and if they make no sense, work to discard them. Having biases may be human, but so is the ability to introspect and to change biases.

rfnslyr 13y ago
Then I'm a racist. Sue me.
- codygman 13y ago
  That's alright most non-poc people, even those that try not to be, are racist because society pushes you towards it constantly. Instead I'll point you here: http://racismschool.tumblr.com/ http://racismschool.tumblr.com/ If you need any help, feel free to message me personally via the email in my profile.
  - rfnslyr 13y ago
    Is it racist to identify cultural differences and strengths and make decisions based off those? For example: I'd much rather hire a Russian programmer than a Chinese programmer simply because I can communicate with the Russian better, we're from similar cultural backgrounds, and I understand where he is from. Is that racist? To pretend that differences don't appear in all types of people is ignorant in itself.

codygman 13y ago

No, this is plain ol' institutionalized racism.