4 ms·

Given the hundreds of millions of Windows users, can you think of thousands (or even hundreds) of Small Businesses making money selling applications to Windows

by ksk 13y ago

Given the hundreds of millions of Windows users, can you think of thousands (or even hundreds) of Small Businesses making money selling applications to Windows users? The only ones that I know of are large companies - Microsoft, Apple, Oracle, Adobe, VMWare, etc. And if you include the parasites of the software world there are the companies like Symantec, Kaspersky and their ilk. But those are all giant companies.

72deluxe 13y ago
Perhaps not thousands. But do you use an online accounting package or do they use Sage or Pegasus? Do you use an online 3D modelling system or do you use Maya / Blender / 3DS Max / SolidWerks etc.? Do you use an online media player or do you use MPlayer / VLC / FFMPEG etc.? Do you play games online in a browser or do you play games written under DirectX / OpenGL that run natively? Was your time scheduled at work using an online system or a timetabling / resource management piece of software? For quotes, do you use an online system or do people use Quotewerks etc.? People forget the massive native application market and the many years of software heritage that Windows permits them to still run. Just because giant companies create widely used applications doesn't mean that there isn't a vast myriad of other software floating around that isn't written to run in a web browser. There is a trend, particularly here on HN, to think that all software revolves around stuff done in a browser but it is narrow minded. Native software typically has a much longer lifespan.
- ksk 13y ago
  How many small businesses are making money shipping software on windows ?
  - 72deluxe 13y ago
    What classes as a small business? Up to what size? I don't have figures but I have worked for 2 in the past that wrote software for Windows, one solely existing for the software, the other for complimenting their services with a side software product. They managed to turnover > £1million and >£4 million respectively. Do we need to have thousands of companies listed in order for their software to qualify as "software" in your eyes? The main point was that Tim ignored desktop native software in his analysis of software, which I felt was an oversight given that probably 98% of jobs involving a computer use desktop software all day long, software that was purchased. I do not see Doris in the admin office using a web browser all day long for her job. Just because you and I might not be buying desktop software in droves does not mean that there isn't a market for it, a pretty sizeable market. Home users might not be buying masses of desktop software but companies still do, particularly through licensing. Tablets haven't changed the way many people do work at work. At home perhaps, but not work. I am not sure what your point is or why the size of the business is important to what software is being produced...?
    - ksk 13y ago
      You can use any definition you like. 50-ish employees? >Do we need to have thousands of companies listed in order for their software to qualify as "software" in your eyes? No, I just asked a simple question because I didn't know. I have no idea what you think you're replying to. But from your reply I get that you don't have the answer to my question. >I am not sure what your point is or why the size of the business is important to what software is being produced...? I just asked a question. I don't know of people starting companies to ship commercial windows software. Ofcource custom software development is certainly a vibrant domain, but that was not the focus of my question. When you see tons of people starting companies to ship software on a platform - that gives you an idea (in general terms) of the 'profitability' of that platform in terms of small business being able to make some money. I have not seen that on the windows platform in quite a while. I don't know why you're assuming I'm some kind of anti-native pro-web person. I'm primarily a low-level C++ programmer.
      - 72deluxe 13y ago
        Apologies for the assumptions! I think you're right that the number of items being shipped on a platform is a good indication, but there's no real way to tell outside the walled gardens. There doesn't appear to be a massive take-up of the Metro app store, so I wonder if people are just ignoring it and still shipping native Win32 apps still? Or just nobody is writing anything? You're right though - I haven't the answer to your question! I wonder where we can get some sort of metric of software being shipped for Windows? As nobody is really funnelling their software through the Windows store, it is probably impossible to get any concrete numbers. Apologies again for the assumptions.
        ksk 13y ago
        Heh, no need for any apologies. My view is that the Metro app store will eventually take off. IMO Microsoft usually rushes to ship not-yet-finished products and which are then refined across successive versions/updates till people eventually accept them. But as far as native apps go, I have not seen many SMEs pop up to ship commercial software on that. In contrast small businesses pop up all the time to ship iOS/Android apps.
  - bruceboughton 13y ago
    Probably more than are making money shipping software on Android.
    - ksk 13y ago
      I have no idea what Android has to do with anything? :S
  - 14113 13y ago
    Quite a lot! However, quite a lot of them aren't exactly writing for consumers, but for the business market.
    - ksk 13y ago
      Are you guessing or do you have any information? Its hard to find good data on this.

by ksk 13y ago

72deluxe 13y ago

Perhaps not thousands. But do you use an online accounting package or do they use Sage or Pegasus? Do you use an online 3D modelling system or do you use Maya / Blender / 3DS Max / SolidWerks etc.? Do you use an online media player or do you use MPlayer / VLC / FFMPEG etc.? Do you play games online in a browser or do you play games written under DirectX / OpenGL that run natively? Was your time scheduled at work using an online system or a timetabling / resource management piece of software? For quotes, do you use an online system or do people use Quotewerks etc.? People forget the massive native application market and the many years of software heritage that Windows permits them to still run. Just because giant companies create widely used applications doesn't mean that there isn't a vast myriad of other software floating around that isn't written to run in a web browser. There is a trend, particularly here on HN, to think that all software revolves around stuff done in a browser but it is narrow minded. Native software typically has a much longer lifespan.

ksk 13y ago
How many small businesses are making money shipping software on windows ?
- 72deluxe 13y ago
  What classes as a small business? Up to what size? I don't have figures but I have worked for 2 in the past that wrote software for Windows, one solely existing for the software, the other for complimenting their services with a side software product. They managed to turnover > £1million and >£4 million respectively. Do we need to have thousands of companies listed in order for their software to qualify as "software" in your eyes? The main point was that Tim ignored desktop native software in his analysis of software, which I felt was an oversight given that probably 98% of jobs involving a computer use desktop software all day long, software that was purchased. I do not see Doris in the admin office using a web browser all day long for her job. Just because you and I might not be buying desktop software in droves does not mean that there isn't a market for it, a pretty sizeable market. Home users might not be buying masses of desktop software but companies still do, particularly through licensing. Tablets haven't changed the way many people do work at work. At home perhaps, but not work. I am not sure what your point is or why the size of the business is important to what software is being produced...?
  - ksk 13y ago
    You can use any definition you like. 50-ish employees? >Do we need to have thousands of companies listed in order for their software to qualify as "software" in your eyes? No, I just asked a simple question because I didn't know. I have no idea what you think you're replying to. But from your reply I get that you don't have the answer to my question. >I am not sure what your point is or why the size of the business is important to what software is being produced...? I just asked a question. I don't know of people starting companies to ship commercial windows software. Ofcource custom software development is certainly a vibrant domain, but that was not the focus of my question. When you see tons of people starting companies to ship software on a platform - that gives you an idea (in general terms) of the 'profitability' of that platform in terms of small business being able to make some money. I have not seen that on the windows platform in quite a while. I don't know why you're assuming I'm some kind of anti-native pro-web person. I'm primarily a low-level C++ programmer.
    - 72deluxe 13y ago
      Apologies for the assumptions! I think you're right that the number of items being shipped on a platform is a good indication, but there's no real way to tell outside the walled gardens. There doesn't appear to be a massive take-up of the Metro app store, so I wonder if people are just ignoring it and still shipping native Win32 apps still? Or just nobody is writing anything? You're right though - I haven't the answer to your question! I wonder where we can get some sort of metric of software being shipped for Windows? As nobody is really funnelling their software through the Windows store, it is probably impossible to get any concrete numbers. Apologies again for the assumptions.
      - ksk 13y ago
        Heh, no need for any apologies. My view is that the Metro app store will eventually take off. IMO Microsoft usually rushes to ship not-yet-finished products and which are then refined across successive versions/updates till people eventually accept them. But as far as native apps go, I have not seen many SMEs pop up to ship commercial software on that. In contrast small businesses pop up all the time to ship iOS/Android apps.
- bruceboughton 13y ago
  Probably more than are making money shipping software on Android.
  - ksk 13y ago
    I have no idea what Android has to do with anything? :S
- 14113 13y ago
  Quite a lot! However, quite a lot of them aren't exactly writing for consumers, but for the business market.
  - ksk 13y ago
    Are you guessing or do you have any information? Its hard to find good data on this.