6 ms·

I can't see any reason why we can't have both; you control the car until it detects a dangerous situation and then takes over. Sounds ideal really, you could go

by ollysb 13y ago

I can't see any reason why we can't have both; you control the car until it detects a dangerous situation and then takes over. Sounds ideal really, you could go faster than you can now, safe in the knowledge that if things go bad the computer will kick in and take over.

bdamm 13y ago
I think part of the safety boost of self-driving cars is that they don't get impatient, and neither will you since you're reading a book/email/facebook/whatever. Self-driving cars ought to also be capable of driving like grandmothers. That's part of why I expect them to be safer. The idea that you can drive a car to the brink of a high-speed collision and then magically expect it to out-react a seasoned driver into avoiding an essentially unavoidable accident is juvenile fantasy.
- m4x 13y ago
  There's no reason why you can't drive it to the brink of a crash and then have it recover for you. The 'brink' in this case is the latest the computer can reliably recover - not a point 100ms before an unavoidable collision.
  - TeMPOraL 13y ago
    But why would you want that? Why wouldn't you want to use a system that can get you to your destination much faster, cheaper and safer[0], only because you want to experience the "fun" of being in a traffic jam? [0] - self-driving cars constantly talking with each other could drive much closer to each other than current "safe distance", much faster, while utilizing aerodynamic effects to conserve fuel, and that system would still in principle be safer than human drivers.
glhaynes 13y ago
I'd think that very often by the time things have gone wrong, it's too late to prevent the crash even with perfect intelligence. Unless perhaps you have the system take back over so often that it's more frustrating to manually drive than to just leave it on auto-pilot anyway.
darklajid 13y ago
This is already the case today, albeit limited. My Audi - makes the steerwheel vibrate if I veer off my lane, actively works against that (limited 'self-steering', but really, really crappy, useless and stupid in its current incarnation) - has lights in the side mirrors that light up when someone's left or right behind of me. If I set the turning signal to a 'blocked' direction, the lights flash. This system is immensely satisfying for me, works awesome. - stops the car on its own if it believes that a crash cannot be avoided and while I still go 30km/h or less. It breaks _immediately_ - issues a high pitched warning noise if it assumes that a collision might be imminent but outside of the safety zone (> 30km/h) - supports automated cruising control, that breaks/accelerates on its own, depending on the traffic ahead and to the side (it won't overtake a car while you're right of it). That said: I love driving. I love leisure rides, love to drive on the Autobahn. That car's rather 'slow' (compared to previous company cars) and tops out at 220km/h. When it is safe I really like to drive at that speed. I think the resistance to self-driving cars is based on mistrust (you give up control, after all) and ego mostly - but it doesn't help the industry or supporters of that idea to paint everyone that likes to drive as a potential 2 ton bullet. A little perspective on both sides would help a lot here.
- Planar 13y ago
  The 2014 Mercedes E- and S-klasses that I've tested also do active intervention if you try to change lanes towards a car in your blindspot. Via braking on the opposite side.
  - darklajid 13y ago
    Interesting. Would love to test that/feel how that works. Here that's not combined, if there's something in my blind spot I just have those lights (flashing if I set a turning signal). There's an assistant that is supposed to keep me in my lane. In theory it ignored lane changes only if I set the turning signal (-> intended by me) and otherwise steers in the opposite direction (I can still beat it, it just tries to convince me otherwise). Plus, it vibrates the steering wheel. It doesn't work, though. Audi was obviously so afraid that people start leaning back and drinking a nice cup of coffee that they added a very annoying 'are you still alive' test. That assistant is going to power down on its own as soon as it things you're not steering anymore. Which often happens without reason (just driving straight). Basically that thing is only working if you hold the steering wheel like a 50's/60's Hollywood star, turning left and right on a dead straight street. Maybe the next incarnation will improve this design..

by ollysb 13y ago

bdamm 13y ago

I think part of the safety boost of self-driving cars is that they don't get impatient, and neither will you since you're reading a book/email/facebook/whatever. Self-driving cars ought to also be capable of driving like grandmothers. That's part of why I expect them to be safer. The idea that you can drive a car to the brink of a high-speed collision and then magically expect it to out-react a seasoned driver into avoiding an essentially unavoidable accident is juvenile fantasy.

m4x 13y ago
There's no reason why you can't drive it to the brink of a crash and then have it recover for you. The 'brink' in this case is the latest the computer can reliably recover - not a point 100ms before an unavoidable collision.
- TeMPOraL 13y ago
  But why would you want that? Why wouldn't you want to use a system that can get you to your destination much faster, cheaper and safer[0], only because you want to experience the "fun" of being in a traffic jam? [0] - self-driving cars constantly talking with each other could drive much closer to each other than current "safe distance", much faster, while utilizing aerodynamic effects to conserve fuel, and that system would still in principle be safer than human drivers.

glhaynes 13y ago

I'd think that very often by the time things have gone wrong, it's too late to prevent the crash even with perfect intelligence. Unless perhaps you have the system take back over so often that it's more frustrating to manually drive than to just leave it on auto-pilot anyway.

darklajid 13y ago

This is already the case today, albeit limited. My Audi - makes the steerwheel vibrate if I veer off my lane, actively works against that (limited 'self-steering', but really, really crappy, useless and stupid in its current incarnation) - has lights in the side mirrors that light up when someone's left or right behind of me. If I set the turning signal to a 'blocked' direction, the lights flash. This system is immensely satisfying for me, works awesome. - stops the car on its own if it believes that a crash cannot be avoided and while I still go 30km/h or less. It breaks _immediately_ - issues a high pitched warning noise if it assumes that a collision might be imminent but outside of the safety zone (> 30km/h) - supports automated cruising control, that breaks/accelerates on its own, depending on the traffic ahead and to the side (it won't overtake a car while you're right of it). That said: I love driving. I love leisure rides, love to drive on the Autobahn. That car's rather 'slow' (compared to previous company cars) and tops out at 220km/h. When it is safe I really like to drive at that speed. I think the resistance to self-driving cars is based on mistrust (you give up control, after all) and ego mostly - but it doesn't help the industry or supporters of that idea to paint everyone that likes to drive as a potential 2 ton bullet. A little perspective on both sides would help a lot here.

Planar 13y ago
The 2014 Mercedes E- and S-klasses that I've tested also do active intervention if you try to change lanes towards a car in your blindspot. Via braking on the opposite side.
- darklajid 13y ago
  Interesting. Would love to test that/feel how that works. Here that's not combined, if there's something in my blind spot I just have those lights (flashing if I set a turning signal). There's an assistant that is supposed to keep me in my lane. In theory it ignored lane changes only if I set the turning signal (-> intended by me) and otherwise steers in the opposite direction (I can still beat it, it just tries to convince me otherwise). Plus, it vibrates the steering wheel. It doesn't work, though. Audi was obviously so afraid that people start leaning back and drinking a nice cup of coffee that they added a very annoying 'are you still alive' test. That assistant is going to power down on its own as soon as it things you're not steering anymore. Which often happens without reason (just driving straight). Basically that thing is only working if you hold the steering wheel like a 50's/60's Hollywood star, turning left and right on a dead straight street. Maybe the next incarnation will improve this design..