5 ms·

The OP was attempting to dismiss the 14 year olds responsibility of action based on his development. We really should expect more of our adolescents. Your obs

by Radix 17y ago

The OP was attempting to dismiss the 14 year olds responsibility of action based on his development. We really should expect more of our adolescents. Your observation that some adults appear to never mature is irrelevant. Society makes its rules known through common sense and law, and any 14 year old that is capable of hacking a tram is intelligent enough to have picked up on society's general distaste for human death and destruction of property. That is, it hardly matters if a specific person is capable of understanding why something is illegal, it is still illegal. What's more, if he was aware enough to study and record the tram system then he was aware of the danger. If he had taken a city bus for a drive no one would be excusing him. The only misunderstanding of social phenomena I can imagine is difficulty interacting with people. Maybe frustration getting attention for his ability due to age. So lets not overlook him, lets not say "well you're just 14, what could we expect". The kid messed up, he should be liable. What he did was pretty cool, stupid, and since no one died, hopefully it won't mess up the rest of his life. (Didn't it used to be part of hacker culture that people should be given credit for their actions regardless of age, sex, or race? Well, this is that, going the opposite direction.)

Confusion 17y ago
Let me first say that I agree that the OP overstated the case: many 14 year olds are perfectly capable of making the right judgment call in cases such as this. However... and any 14 year old that is capable of hacking a tram is intelligent enough to have picked up on society's general distaste Intelligence has little to do with the ability to empathize or with social skills in general. Yes, an intelligent person with an autistic disorder may be able to mitigate the consequences of his disability by learning the required responses. However, a fourteen year old will never have mastered that technique yet and some never do. And no, I'm not claiming this boy has an autistic disorder; what I am claiming is that many such people, myself included, have traits that much resemble those of people with autistic disorders, to the point where I often feel like I'm responding from knowledge to social situations, rather then from feeling. And I remember a particularly (in hindsight) stupid thing I almost did when I was a 12 years old, because I had no regard for the people involved. Nor for the consequences for me BTW. That is one important point people are overlooking: the boy may also have failed to realize he could go to prison for this. So busy tinkering and playing that he lost sight of the outside world. What's more, if he was aware enough to study and record the tram system then he was aware of the danger Rationally knowing something could go wrong and linking that to actual people actually suffering is a huge step for some people. Eichmann is probably the canonical example. Yes, he was liable and he was rightfully held accountable. That doesn't necessarily mean he was guilty in a moral sense. Can you be guilty of failing to consider consequences to other humans, if failing to consider those consequences is your natural way of being? I'd rather call it a mental disability than criminal intent.

by Radix 17y ago

Confusion 17y ago

Let me first say that I agree that the OP overstated the case: many 14 year olds are perfectly capable of making the right judgment call in cases such as this. However... and any 14 year old that is capable of hacking a tram is intelligent enough to have picked up on society's general distaste Intelligence has little to do with the ability to empathize or with social skills in general. Yes, an intelligent person with an autistic disorder may be able to mitigate the consequences of his disability by learning the required responses. However, a fourteen year old will never have mastered that technique yet and some never do. And no, I'm not claiming this boy has an autistic disorder; what I am claiming is that many such people, myself included, have traits that much resemble those of people with autistic disorders, to the point where I often feel like I'm responding from knowledge to social situations, rather then from feeling. And I remember a particularly (in hindsight) stupid thing I almost did when I was a 12 years old, because I had no regard for the people involved. Nor for the consequences for me BTW. That is one important point people are overlooking: the boy may also have failed to realize he could go to prison for this. So busy tinkering and playing that he lost sight of the outside world. What's more, if he was aware enough to study and record the tram system then he was aware of the danger Rationally knowing something could go wrong and linking that to actual people actually suffering is a huge step for some people. Eichmann is probably the canonical example. Yes, he was liable and he was rightfully held accountable. That doesn't necessarily mean he was guilty in a moral sense. Can you be guilty of failing to consider consequences to other humans, if failing to consider those consequences is your natural way of being? I'd rather call it a mental disability than criminal intent.