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Why can't people just be wrong anymore (and admit to it)? I'm sure there's some amount of rose-tinted glasses going on here but as a 40 year old I seem to reme

Why can't people just be wrong anymore (and admit to it)? I'm sure there's some amount of rose-tinted glasses going on here but as a 40 year old I seem to remember a now long-lost past when people could more readily issue a mea culpa, promise to try harder and everyone could move along without every discussion turning into a battle where the person who fucked up expends massive amounts of energy trying to prove they didn't fuck up by selectively choosing to cling on to ways they could possibly weasel out of the issue without actually saying they made an error in judgement (or allowed one to be made on their watch). To be fully fair, the sincere mea culpa does still occur sometimes and we've even seen it here on HN with some startups/founders who fucked up, but it happens so rarely now that when I see those exceptions that prove the rule they are surprising, which is sad. Ignoring the human element, this sort of non-apology response isn't even a good strategy if you look at things in a purely Machiavellian way. "Yeah, sorry, I fucked up, I'll fix this" gains you a bunch of goodwill, repairs reputation and trust (so long as you aren't fucking up constantly). OTOH, the typical "Nah, I wasn't wrong, here's why you're wrong to think that" or "I'm sorry you were offended by the thing I did" response does nothing but make you look like an immature ass, so why pursue this strategy? Even in borderline cases where you still think you were kind of right, just fucking apologize and move on! It is clearly the +EV move. As a non-subscriber to The Information I previously had a fairly neutral view of them as I just sadly sort of accept selective misquoting as the way things work now, but reading this "How We Operate" thing skewed my view harshly negative.

joshdotsmith 13y ago
Totally agree with this sentiment. One of the best things enlisting ever taught me is not to quibble. Own up and drive on.
- reeses 13y ago
  As another old person, I blame the shift from "mea culpa" to "my bad." One is used when genuinely accepting responsibility and the other is used like a wave after cutting someone off in traffic. The answer is to reintroduce the classics into the educational system. Cursive, too.
waterlesscloud 13y ago
You know, in most cases the refusal to 'fess up just makes someone look stubborn. The interesting thing in this case is that it makes them look incompetent.
olefoo 13y ago
Up until the last paragraph I thought you were going to say that your opinion of Paul Graham had become much more negative. To be fair most of the people directly involved in this ruckus don't come out of it looking all that well; but The Information did say the interview was on the record and did tell Graham that it was getting published and didn't get pushback. The fact that Valleywag was able to stir up a controversy and garner a massive amount of traffic off the back of PG's somewhat inept handling of a sensitive question ( that he knew was sensitive ) does no credit to Valleywag, even if it is their business model. Those people who slotted this into their preexisting models of reality and tried to use it as a teaching opportunity may feel rather threatening to some. which may mean they need to rethink their tactics; but may just mean that some people feel threatened whenever the topic of gender equity is brought up. Now I get that what PG was saying was not nearly as inflammatory as it was made out to be by Valleywag. However, it did bring to light some unconscious bias on his part; and I get that that is very hard to acknowledge and correct, especially when you have to do so in the full glare of hostile publicity. I do hope the PG can take some time to reflect and to reach out to some of the people who have substantive criticisms of his thinking on this topic. note: I'm not saying that he needs to turn ycombinator into a feminist reeducation camp, just that he needs to _listen_ to what some of his critics are trying to point out to him. note the second: I've been participating in HN for 6 years or so; and I have to say that the level of reflexive sexism I've seen in the comments this past week is making me think I should abandon my account.
- wvenable 13y ago
  > it did bring to light some unconscious bias on his part Can you expand on that? Because from his actual quote I don't find anything unreasonable or biased about his opinions on this particular issue. It seems to me like while pg is no longer guilty of being overtly anti-woman-in-technology, his reputation is now unfairly tarnished by this attention.
  - ceol 13y ago
    I'm just getting familiar with this drama, but to me, it sounds like pg was dropping responsibility for the lack of women founders. Eric asked him about YC doing more to attract women or encourage women founders, and he responded by saying, essentially, "It's not our fault, there's no way we could be biased, women who want to be hackers just don't exist," and passing the buck to middle school curriculums.

joshdotsmith 13y ago

Totally agree with this sentiment. One of the best things enlisting ever taught me is not to quibble. Own up and drive on.

reeses 13y ago
As another old person, I blame the shift from "mea culpa" to "my bad." One is used when genuinely accepting responsibility and the other is used like a wave after cutting someone off in traffic. The answer is to reintroduce the classics into the educational system. Cursive, too.

waterlesscloud 13y ago

You know, in most cases the refusal to 'fess up just makes someone look stubborn. The interesting thing in this case is that it makes them look incompetent.

olefoo 13y ago

Up until the last paragraph I thought you were going to say that your opinion of Paul Graham had become much more negative. To be fair most of the people directly involved in this ruckus don't come out of it looking all that well; but The Information did say the interview was on the record and did tell Graham that it was getting published and didn't get pushback. The fact that Valleywag was able to stir up a controversy and garner a massive amount of traffic off the back of PG's somewhat inept handling of a sensitive question ( that he knew was sensitive ) does no credit to Valleywag, even if it is their business model. Those people who slotted this into their preexisting models of reality and tried to use it as a teaching opportunity may feel rather threatening to some. which may mean they need to rethink their tactics; but may just mean that some people feel threatened whenever the topic of gender equity is brought up. Now I get that what PG was saying was not nearly as inflammatory as it was made out to be by Valleywag. However, it did bring to light some unconscious bias on his part; and I get that that is very hard to acknowledge and correct, especially when you have to do so in the full glare of hostile publicity. I do hope the PG can take some time to reflect and to reach out to some of the people who have substantive criticisms of his thinking on this topic. note: I'm not saying that he needs to turn ycombinator into a feminist reeducation camp, just that he needs to _listen_ to what some of his critics are trying to point out to him. note the second: I've been participating in HN for 6 years or so; and I have to say that the level of reflexive sexism I've seen in the comments this past week is making me think I should abandon my account.

wvenable 13y ago
> it did bring to light some unconscious bias on his part Can you expand on that? Because from his actual quote I don't find anything unreasonable or biased about his opinions on this particular issue. It seems to me like while pg is no longer guilty of being overtly anti-woman-in-technology, his reputation is now unfairly tarnished by this attention.
- ceol 13y ago
  I'm just getting familiar with this drama, but to me, it sounds like pg was dropping responsibility for the lack of women founders. Eric asked him about YC doing more to attract women or encourage women founders, and he responded by saying, essentially, "It's not our fault, there's no way we could be biased, women who want to be hackers just don't exist," and passing the buck to middle school curriculums.