4 ms·

I've been following redfin since their early days and was very excited by their business model. They were featured on 60 minutes about a 1-2 years ago too, whi

by sgoraya 17y ago

I've been following redfin since their early days and was very excited by their business model. They were featured on 60 minutes about a 1-2 years ago too, which helped them gain some mainstream momentum. The real estate industry, specifically residential real estate, is in the process of rebooting. A lot of the legwork that agents were doing in the past can now be accomplished by the buyer/seller and much of the information can be found on real estate aggregation sites. Not to say that residential agents will be extinct anytime soon (they still provide a service) but their commissions will definitely be affected. Commercial/Industrial/Ag. real estate on the other hand, still requires professional agents, IMO. Specific knowledge (legal/zoning issues/environmental impact reports/etc. etc.) is needed in these areas to assist buyers/sellers.

silencio 17y ago
I might just be dealing with a particularly bad commercial broker right now, but he is all about covering his behind and refusing to do anything beyond his bare minimum, that is to say, the only thing he's ever told me about phase 1 ESAs is a piece of paper detailing my responsibilities in general. Which, well, my lender and other people have already told me about. He also told me to go figure out all the other legal issues on my own with someone who specializes in commercial real estate law. I actually did do this with more than one lawyer prior to submitting an offer, and I ended up having a 4 hour long fight with the broker over changing some wording, only to get lectured at the end about how I need to learn to not change legal documents written by lawyers and how I should be leaving all the paperwork to the grownups because I was a 20 year old female sitting in front of him eating frozen yogurt...wait, we were having lunch and it is my corporation of which I have a controlling interest in that's buying this property and it is my bank accounts funding the majority of the purchase price, right?! I think I just stared at him and didn't sign anything until he conceded. He tried to lie his way into making me initial parts of the offer that were clearly voluntary as well. I'm extremely tempted to file some complaints... So I honestly do see a market for a Redfin-esque service for commercial real estate and even buying/selling businesses. If only to get rid of that nonsense.
- sgoraya 17y ago
  Ouch! That guy sounds like total asshole, to say the least! Definitely not doing his job and does not deserve your time and business. My experiences with commercial agents has been relegated to the broker that we have been using for over a 10 year period. I agree though, a redfin type service will also evolve and take shape for commercial properties. However, from the commercial side of things, a lot more due diligence needs to be done (depending on the property type) as opposed to buying a home. And often times many 'good' commercial properties never make it to a listing service like loopnet etc.
  - silencio 17y ago
    I wish I could ignore him and deal with someone else but there's a whole culture of exclusivity that seems to exist around these things. Not to mention it's hard to find anyone better in the first place, since they all seem to be the same give or take very little. I'm willing to deal with him for the property in question though, it's just that good. Redfin for commercial real estate would be complicated pricing and service-wise because of what you mention and more issues unique to commercial deals, but I think it could have as big of an impact as Redfin itself has had for residential homes. And oh, loopnet+something like redfin? That would be amazing...
- Shooter 17y ago
  I agree the guy sounds like a condescending ass, and I think maybe you should file a complaint. That said, he MAY have a point about changing the wording on the legal document. Most states have had strict laws about real estate professionals changing the wording on contracts since the '50s or '60s, believe it or not. In most states, brokers and salespersons are only allowed to fill in blanks on printed form contracts that are 'customarily used' (usually defined as drafted or pre-approved by the local bar association) and to insert or delete items only at the direction of the principal in the course of negotiations. While the last part sounds like it allows what you want, it is very easy for the broker to get sued for doing these insertions and deletions, because almost anything they say when this is happening can be construed to be the "unauthorized practice of law." And when I say "get sued" I don't necessarily mean by you. It was complaints and lawsuits from bar associations that led to these restrictive laws...the attorneys didn't want more competitors for basic services, just like they have sued internet companies that are selling legal documents such as wills. Anyway, many brokers are advised to completely avoid changing the wording on contracts. E&O insurers sometimes even write stricter guidelines brokers have to follow in these matters in order to get covered under insurance policies. And the broker's company may also have its own policies. BTW, depending on where you're located, there ARE companies that are more on the Redfin end of the spectrum and that have Loopnet-ish sites.

by sgoraya 17y ago

silencio 17y ago

I might just be dealing with a particularly bad commercial broker right now, but he is all about covering his behind and refusing to do anything beyond his bare minimum, that is to say, the only thing he's ever told me about phase 1 ESAs is a piece of paper detailing my responsibilities in general. Which, well, my lender and other people have already told me about. He also told me to go figure out all the other legal issues on my own with someone who specializes in commercial real estate law. I actually did do this with more than one lawyer prior to submitting an offer, and I ended up having a 4 hour long fight with the broker over changing some wording, only to get lectured at the end about how I need to learn to not change legal documents written by lawyers and how I should be leaving all the paperwork to the grownups because I was a 20 year old female sitting in front of him eating frozen yogurt...wait, we were having lunch and it is my corporation of which I have a controlling interest in that's buying this property and it is my bank accounts funding the majority of the purchase price, right?! I think I just stared at him and didn't sign anything until he conceded. He tried to lie his way into making me initial parts of the offer that were clearly voluntary as well. I'm extremely tempted to file some complaints... So I honestly do see a market for a Redfin-esque service for commercial real estate and even buying/selling businesses. If only to get rid of that nonsense.

sgoraya 17y ago
Ouch! That guy sounds like total asshole, to say the least! Definitely not doing his job and does not deserve your time and business. My experiences with commercial agents has been relegated to the broker that we have been using for over a 10 year period. I agree though, a redfin type service will also evolve and take shape for commercial properties. However, from the commercial side of things, a lot more due diligence needs to be done (depending on the property type) as opposed to buying a home. And often times many 'good' commercial properties never make it to a listing service like loopnet etc.
- silencio 17y ago
  I wish I could ignore him and deal with someone else but there's a whole culture of exclusivity that seems to exist around these things. Not to mention it's hard to find anyone better in the first place, since they all seem to be the same give or take very little. I'm willing to deal with him for the property in question though, it's just that good. Redfin for commercial real estate would be complicated pricing and service-wise because of what you mention and more issues unique to commercial deals, but I think it could have as big of an impact as Redfin itself has had for residential homes. And oh, loopnet+something like redfin? That would be amazing...
Shooter 17y ago
I agree the guy sounds like a condescending ass, and I think maybe you should file a complaint. That said, he MAY have a point about changing the wording on the legal document. Most states have had strict laws about real estate professionals changing the wording on contracts since the '50s or '60s, believe it or not. In most states, brokers and salespersons are only allowed to fill in blanks on printed form contracts that are 'customarily used' (usually defined as drafted or pre-approved by the local bar association) and to insert or delete items only at the direction of the principal in the course of negotiations. While the last part sounds like it allows what you want, it is very easy for the broker to get sued for doing these insertions and deletions, because almost anything they say when this is happening can be construed to be the "unauthorized practice of law." And when I say "get sued" I don't necessarily mean by you. It was complaints and lawsuits from bar associations that led to these restrictive laws...the attorneys didn't want more competitors for basic services, just like they have sued internet companies that are selling legal documents such as wills. Anyway, many brokers are advised to completely avoid changing the wording on contracts. E&O insurers sometimes even write stricter guidelines brokers have to follow in these matters in order to get covered under insurance policies. And the broker's company may also have its own policies. BTW, depending on where you're located, there ARE companies that are more on the Redfin end of the spectrum and that have Loopnet-ish sites.