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It's not just money, it's accountability, it's income of the students, it's how progress is measured... Tossing money at a broken school is about as productive

It's not just money, it's accountability, it's income of the students, it's how progress is measured... Tossing money at a broken school is about as productive as tossing money at an overdue software project. Conceivably it could help, but the data suggests that you should fix the root cause of the problem first.

rayiner 13y ago
I'll go one further than that: we blame schools for not fixing what are fundamentally deep-seated social, rather than educational, problems. Tossing more money at schools, broken or functional, isn't productive. Half of all children in Chicago live in single-parent homes, and the poverty rate for families headed by a single mother are around 40%: http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-11-03/news/ct-edit-xproject5a-family-1103-20131103_1_fathers-mothers-many-kids http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-11-03/news/ct-edit-x.... That percentage is almost certainly much higher within the Chicago public school system, which skews poorer than the city as a whole. You can't have functional schools with students who have to worry more about gang violence in their neighborhood than their grades. More money, better curricula, better teachers, none of that matters when the social structure outside the school is crumbling. I imagine much of the dysfunction endemic to urban school systems is related to the Sisyphean nature of the task we give them. We focus almost single-mindedly on schools and education to solve all the ills of urban society. If only our schools were functional and our teachers competent, we say, these kids would be able to rise out of their condition and better themselves. But teachers who teach in these systems realize the absurdity of that charge. Stuck between a student population that needs help in ways that are not within their power to give, and a society that fails to realize the actual needs of these young people, teachers shift to a mode focused on self-preservation. Hence the dysfunction present in urban school systems.
- mathattack 13y ago
  Here's the strange thing though... Some charter schools do educate the same poor populations, and do it well. The Success Academy [1] is very controversial, but their kids in Harlem and the Bronx do get good test scores. [2] One can argue that they weed out bad apples, but the numbers are still phenomenal even if you assume they've pushed out the bottom 10%. Of course the new mayor of New York wants to stop their growth, but that's another complaint. [1] http://www.successacademies.org/ http://www.successacademies.org/ [2] http://projects.nytimes.com/new-york-schools-test-scores/counties/new-york/districts/new-york-city-district-3/schools/harlem-success-academy-charter-school http://projects.nytimes.com/new-york-schools-test-scores/cou... and http://perdidostreetschool.blogspot.com/2013/08/bronx-success-academy-2-ranks-3rd-in.html http://perdidostreetschool.blogspot.com/2013/08/bronx-succes...
  - rayiner 13y ago
    I'd imagine the students at charter schools have families trying very hard to overcome the ambient culture.
    - mathattack 13y ago
      Yes, that too. But what's wrong with giving all those families opportunities in schools that allow it, rather than forcing them into cesspools that people are afraid to close for political reasons?
  - gensym 13y ago
    Not so strange once you find out the some charter schools can effectively choose their populations via disciplinary measures. http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/education/success-academy-fire-parents-fight-disciplinary-policy-article-1.1438753 http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/education/success-academ...

rayiner 13y ago

I'll go one further than that: we blame schools for not fixing what are fundamentally deep-seated social, rather than educational, problems. Tossing more money at schools, broken or functional, isn't productive. Half of all children in Chicago live in single-parent homes, and the poverty rate for families headed by a single mother are around 40%: http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-11-03/news/ct-edit-xproject5a-family-1103-20131103_1_fathers-mothers-many-kids http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-11-03/news/ct-edit-x.... That percentage is almost certainly much higher within the Chicago public school system, which skews poorer than the city as a whole. You can't have functional schools with students who have to worry more about gang violence in their neighborhood than their grades. More money, better curricula, better teachers, none of that matters when the social structure outside the school is crumbling. I imagine much of the dysfunction endemic to urban school systems is related to the Sisyphean nature of the task we give them. We focus almost single-mindedly on schools and education to solve all the ills of urban society. If only our schools were functional and our teachers competent, we say, these kids would be able to rise out of their condition and better themselves. But teachers who teach in these systems realize the absurdity of that charge. Stuck between a student population that needs help in ways that are not within their power to give, and a society that fails to realize the actual needs of these young people, teachers shift to a mode focused on self-preservation. Hence the dysfunction present in urban school systems.

mathattack 13y ago
Here's the strange thing though... Some charter schools do educate the same poor populations, and do it well. The Success Academy [1] is very controversial, but their kids in Harlem and the Bronx do get good test scores. [2] One can argue that they weed out bad apples, but the numbers are still phenomenal even if you assume they've pushed out the bottom 10%. Of course the new mayor of New York wants to stop their growth, but that's another complaint. [1] http://www.successacademies.org/ http://www.successacademies.org/ [2] http://projects.nytimes.com/new-york-schools-test-scores/counties/new-york/districts/new-york-city-district-3/schools/harlem-success-academy-charter-school http://projects.nytimes.com/new-york-schools-test-scores/cou... and http://perdidostreetschool.blogspot.com/2013/08/bronx-success-academy-2-ranks-3rd-in.html http://perdidostreetschool.blogspot.com/2013/08/bronx-succes...
- rayiner 13y ago
  I'd imagine the students at charter schools have families trying very hard to overcome the ambient culture.
  - mathattack 13y ago
    Yes, that too. But what's wrong with giving all those families opportunities in schools that allow it, rather than forcing them into cesspools that people are afraid to close for political reasons?
- gensym 13y ago
  Not so strange once you find out the some charter schools can effectively choose their populations via disciplinary measures. http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/education/success-academy-fire-parents-fight-disciplinary-policy-article-1.1438753 http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/education/success-academ...