3 ms·

Again, a broad request like this is not illegal...

retrogradeorbit 13y ago
This is true, of course. The dominant power never legislates against its own self interest. And so many of the darkest parts of human history were done legally. The real issue here goes deeper than the law. The thing is, not many people believe a word the government says any-more. This is the government that doesn't "collect" any information on their citizens, doesn't "torture" anyone and so on. The government can make any promises it wants, with no intention of fulfilling them, then claim that the meanings of the words are not what you think they are, but the real meanings are secret, and why they're secret, is secret, and no one can ever know the true meaning lest we all be killed by terrorists. And isn't it funny that the government can't seem to bring itself to find this pen-register information development fee, but there seems to be an infinite line of deficit spending for all kinds of corporate subsidies, bank bailouts, spying equipment and wedding killing drones. The lawyers may argue and the courts may rule, but at the end of the day the core of this apple is rotten. And there's worms in it. Take a bite. It tastes like "freedom".
malandrew 13y ago
I can't understand why it is not illegal by way of being unconstitutional since it clearly tramples on the 4th amendment rights of all the other subscribers. Absent clear mechanisms for watching the watchmen to make sure they not only respecting the 4th amendment rights of the other subscribers, but technically incapable of doing so (in order to mitigate rogue actors that want to impress their superiors via fishing expeditions), I can't see why we should have any reason to believe this information will not be abused. The government, especially the NSA and the FBI (by way of parallel construction), have proven to be outright liars. This alone should be enough for a judge to rule against the right of the government to make such broad requests. The government has be proven guilty of lying here. The burden is now on them to show that they are no longer guilty.

This is true, of course. The dominant power never legislates against its own self interest. And so many of the darkest parts of human history were done legally. The real issue here goes deeper than the law. The thing is, not many people believe a word the government says any-more. This is the government that doesn't "collect" any information on their citizens, doesn't "torture" anyone and so on. The government can make any promises it wants, with no intention of fulfilling them, then claim that the meanings of the words are not what you think they are, but the real meanings are secret, and why they're secret, is secret, and no one can ever know the true meaning lest we all be killed by terrorists. And isn't it funny that the government can't seem to bring itself to find this pen-register information development fee, but there seems to be an infinite line of deficit spending for all kinds of corporate subsidies, bank bailouts, spying equipment and wedding killing drones. The lawyers may argue and the courts may rule, but at the end of the day the core of this apple is rotten. And there's worms in it. Take a bite. It tastes like "freedom".

malandrew 13y ago

I can't understand why it is not illegal by way of being unconstitutional since it clearly tramples on the 4th amendment rights of all the other subscribers. Absent clear mechanisms for watching the watchmen to make sure they not only respecting the 4th amendment rights of the other subscribers, but technically incapable of doing so (in order to mitigate rogue actors that want to impress their superiors via fishing expeditions), I can't see why we should have any reason to believe this information will not be abused. The government, especially the NSA and the FBI (by way of parallel construction), have proven to be outright liars. This alone should be enough for a judge to rule against the right of the government to make such broad requests. The government has be proven guilty of lying here. The burden is now on them to show that they are no longer guilty.