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The poster isn't painting capitalism with a broad brush, we're specifically talking about a free market economy. We've never seen how a free market economy act

The poster isn't painting capitalism with a broad brush, we're specifically talking about a free market economy. We've never seen how a free market economy actually works because we don't let free market economies form without first destroying them via regulation. We have models which persuasively suggest that a free market economy would be the most efficient possible form of trade, or at least way more efficient than our overrregulated fustercluck. So the poster seems to be saying "jeeze, why don't we try an actual free market economy"! Which seems eminently reasonable to me, and not at all "imposing his story on reality".

eli_gottlieb 13y ago
This is equivalent to saying that criticisms of the Soviet Union have nothing to do with socialism because, "Workers controlling the means of production has never been tried!" Yes it has. If you are going to claim that your desired system has never existed on the face of Earth, then your desired system is a utopian ideal that most likely cannot exist in the real world, or worse, would behave like a standard revolutionary utopia by destroying actually existing societies when you attempt to create it. Oh, wait, that's exactly how neoliberalism behaves. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actually_existing_capitalism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actually_existing_capitalism
- obstacle1 13y ago
  >This is equivalent to saying that criticisms of the Soviet Union have nothing to do with socialism because, "Workers controlling the means of production has never been tried!" The word you want is communism, not socialism. And the criticism is valid: the USSR was far from a communist state. It was more like a mixed economy leaning communist. Nobody is going to deny that there were elements of socialism in the USSR, just as there are elements of socialism in the USA now. Socialism != communism. And I'll repeat: we're talking about a specific thing, not all capitalism. This thread is re: whether or not pure free markets work, not whether or not capitalism works. Hence your link misses the point; as, I suspect, do you.

eli_gottlieb 13y ago

This is equivalent to saying that criticisms of the Soviet Union have nothing to do with socialism because, "Workers controlling the means of production has never been tried!" Yes it has. If you are going to claim that your desired system has never existed on the face of Earth, then your desired system is a utopian ideal that most likely cannot exist in the real world, or worse, would behave like a standard revolutionary utopia by destroying actually existing societies when you attempt to create it. Oh, wait, that's exactly how neoliberalism behaves. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actually_existing_capitalism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actually_existing_capitalism

obstacle1 13y ago
>This is equivalent to saying that criticisms of the Soviet Union have nothing to do with socialism because, "Workers controlling the means of production has never been tried!" The word you want is communism, not socialism. And the criticism is valid: the USSR was far from a communist state. It was more like a mixed economy leaning communist. Nobody is going to deny that there were elements of socialism in the USSR, just as there are elements of socialism in the USA now. Socialism != communism. And I'll repeat: we're talking about a specific thing, not all capitalism. This thread is re: whether or not pure free markets work, not whether or not capitalism works. Hence your link misses the point; as, I suspect, do you.