4 ms·

First chart cuts off in '09, before Obamas tax hikes. Also probably doesn't include state/local income tax burden (!!). US has one of harshest tax regimes for t

First chart cuts off in '09, before Obamas tax hikes. Also probably doesn't include state/local income tax burden (!!). US has one of harshest tax regimes for top earners, and amongst most progressive regimes in OECD (arguably THE most progressive). Second chart is straight nonsense: counts unrepatriated money - capital stuck abroad whilst awaiting change in broken US corp tax policy - as taxed at zero percent! Both are cute gimmicks and nothing more.

FireBeyond 13y ago
Please, before you start calling things 'cute gimmicks', provide a citation, especially for this claim: "US has one of the harshest tax regimes for top earners". Because per multiple sources, including this one: http://money.cnn.com/2012/10/01/news/economy/millionaire-taxes/ http://money.cnn.com/2012/10/01/news/economy/millionaire-tax... - it's demonstrably wrong, and not even close: "France has the highest tax rate with a 75% rate on millionaires. In the U.S., the fight is over whether to extend the top rate to little more than half that amount." "In Washington, of course, the fight is over whether to raise the top rate to a level just over half the amount they are arguing about in France -- to 39.6% from 35%. By contrast, numerous countries have top rates in the low to mid-50s, including Austria, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, Japan and Sweden. The world's highest rate is levied in sunny Aruba, where people making more than $171,000 face a top rate of 58.95%, according to figures compiled by KPMG." As does this link: http://www.dailyfinance.com/2013/04/14/think-your-taxes-are-high-the-5-countries-with-the/ http://www.dailyfinance.com/2013/04/14/think-your-taxes-are-... - which also casts significant aspersions on your claim: "For comparison: The United States 2012 top rate of income taxes: 35% (rising to 39.6% in 2013) Effective tax rate on $100,000: 26% (7.3% Social Security, 18.7% income tax) World rank on effective tax rate of $100,000: 55 Effective tax rate on $300,000: 30.5% (3.7% Social Security, 26.8% income tax) World rank on effective tax rate of $300,000: 53"
- alexeisadeski3 13y ago
  Top US tax rate is over 55%: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates Going over 58% in 2014, thanks to Obamacare levy. Like I said, one of the highest in OECD. And arguably most progressive in all of OECD: US lacks severe excise taxes and VATs which target the poor and middle class, coupled with generously progressive income tax brackets. And of course those infamously high US corporate tax rates: often double the rates of other OECD nations (same link).
  - FireBeyond 13y ago
    Hmm, interesting link. Confusing though, because the citations for: "55.9% (max of federal+state+local) 10%-39.6% (federal)[136] + 0%-13.3% (state)[137] + 0%-3% (local)" lead to a link at the Tax Foundation that lists /only/ "Selected Federal Rates": "136. "State Corporate Income Tax Rates, 2000-2013". Tax Foundation. Retrieved 2013-05-17. 137. "State Corporate Income Tax Rates, 2000-2013". Tax Foundation. Retrieved 2013-05-17." Despite the titles thereof. I find it odd, too, that all the US references are to the Tax Foundation, which has had numerous criticisms leveled at it as a conservative think tank, not least of which: "US economist Paul Krugman has characterised the Tax Foundation as "not a reliable source" while criticizing a report by the Tax Foundation comparing corporate tax rates in the United States to those in other countries.[46] Krugman has also accused the Tax Foundation of "deliberate fraud" in connection with a report it issued concerning the American Jobs Act.[47]" There's all this not insubstantial disclaimer to your table: "Some other taxes (for instance property tax, substantial in many countries, such as the USA) are not shown here. The table is not intended to represent the true tax burden to either the corporation or the individual in the listed country." Not that there's not pause for thought. But it's intriguing that multiple independent sources list our highest task rates around the 30th to 55th in the world, but yet the Tax Foundation lists at nearly the top.
    - alexeisadeski3 13y ago
      @FireBeyond Straight from the horses mouth: California income tax rate: 12.3% California C Corp tax rate: 8.84-10.84% https://www.ftb.ca.gov/forms/2013_california_tax_rates_and_exemptions.shtml https://www.ftb.ca.gov/forms/2013_california_tax_rates_and_e... Federal income tax rate: 39.6% (43% 2014) [no citation needed, I trust] Side note to you: Read around, beyond the NYT/CNN/FOX/etc propagandists. You'll find, I trust, that the US does in fact have more progressive taxation overall than most if not all OECD members. I've spoken with a few researchers and they've unanimously backed up this "finding". Tough to compare such data across nations and jurisdictions, but it's possible to get a general idea. Want to really blow your mind? Look into enforcement - appears the US is far stricter on US rich earners foreign income than rest of OECD as well! Universal taxation of citizens is quite... remarkable. To say nothing of my own reading of the OECD's GINI adjustment nonsense. But I don't want to make you too dubious too early. I'll leave that one for later.

FireBeyond 13y ago

Please, before you start calling things 'cute gimmicks', provide a citation, especially for this claim: "US has one of the harshest tax regimes for top earners". Because per multiple sources, including this one: http://money.cnn.com/2012/10/01/news/economy/millionaire-taxes/ http://money.cnn.com/2012/10/01/news/economy/millionaire-tax... - it's demonstrably wrong, and not even close: "France has the highest tax rate with a 75% rate on millionaires. In the U.S., the fight is over whether to extend the top rate to little more than half that amount." "In Washington, of course, the fight is over whether to raise the top rate to a level just over half the amount they are arguing about in France -- to 39.6% from 35%. By contrast, numerous countries have top rates in the low to mid-50s, including Austria, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, Japan and Sweden. The world's highest rate is levied in sunny Aruba, where people making more than $171,000 face a top rate of 58.95%, according to figures compiled by KPMG." As does this link: http://www.dailyfinance.com/2013/04/14/think-your-taxes-are-high-the-5-countries-with-the/ http://www.dailyfinance.com/2013/04/14/think-your-taxes-are-... - which also casts significant aspersions on your claim: "For comparison: The United States 2012 top rate of income taxes: 35% (rising to 39.6% in 2013) Effective tax rate on $100,000: 26% (7.3% Social Security, 18.7% income tax) World rank on effective tax rate of $100,000: 55 Effective tax rate on $300,000: 30.5% (3.7% Social Security, 26.8% income tax) World rank on effective tax rate of $300,000: 53"

alexeisadeski3 13y ago
Top US tax rate is over 55%: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates Going over 58% in 2014, thanks to Obamacare levy. Like I said, one of the highest in OECD. And arguably most progressive in all of OECD: US lacks severe excise taxes and VATs which target the poor and middle class, coupled with generously progressive income tax brackets. And of course those infamously high US corporate tax rates: often double the rates of other OECD nations (same link).
- FireBeyond 13y ago
  Hmm, interesting link. Confusing though, because the citations for: "55.9% (max of federal+state+local) 10%-39.6% (federal)[136] + 0%-13.3% (state)[137] + 0%-3% (local)" lead to a link at the Tax Foundation that lists /only/ "Selected Federal Rates": "136. "State Corporate Income Tax Rates, 2000-2013". Tax Foundation. Retrieved 2013-05-17. 137. "State Corporate Income Tax Rates, 2000-2013". Tax Foundation. Retrieved 2013-05-17." Despite the titles thereof. I find it odd, too, that all the US references are to the Tax Foundation, which has had numerous criticisms leveled at it as a conservative think tank, not least of which: "US economist Paul Krugman has characterised the Tax Foundation as "not a reliable source" while criticizing a report by the Tax Foundation comparing corporate tax rates in the United States to those in other countries.[46] Krugman has also accused the Tax Foundation of "deliberate fraud" in connection with a report it issued concerning the American Jobs Act.[47]" There's all this not insubstantial disclaimer to your table: "Some other taxes (for instance property tax, substantial in many countries, such as the USA) are not shown here. The table is not intended to represent the true tax burden to either the corporation or the individual in the listed country." Not that there's not pause for thought. But it's intriguing that multiple independent sources list our highest task rates around the 30th to 55th in the world, but yet the Tax Foundation lists at nearly the top.
  - alexeisadeski3 13y ago
    @FireBeyond Straight from the horses mouth: California income tax rate: 12.3% California C Corp tax rate: 8.84-10.84% https://www.ftb.ca.gov/forms/2013_california_tax_rates_and_exemptions.shtml https://www.ftb.ca.gov/forms/2013_california_tax_rates_and_e... Federal income tax rate: 39.6% (43% 2014) [no citation needed, I trust] Side note to you: Read around, beyond the NYT/CNN/FOX/etc propagandists. You'll find, I trust, that the US does in fact have more progressive taxation overall than most if not all OECD members. I've spoken with a few researchers and they've unanimously backed up this "finding". Tough to compare such data across nations and jurisdictions, but it's possible to get a general idea. Want to really blow your mind? Look into enforcement - appears the US is far stricter on US rich earners foreign income than rest of OECD as well! Universal taxation of citizens is quite... remarkable. To say nothing of my own reading of the OECD's GINI adjustment nonsense. But I don't want to make you too dubious too early. I'll leave that one for later.