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Can you explain in more detail? I am actually curious, because as a customer I hate the watermarks. Do you think they help with brand awareness, or driving tr

Can you explain in more detail? I am actually curious, because as a customer I hate the watermarks. Do you think they help with brand awareness, or driving traffic to your own site?

johnnyg 13y ago
Summary: If we publish our home brewed content without watermarks and it is lifted off google and used to compete against us, we have no effective recourse. Detail: In our company, one advancement track is from Customer Service to Products. It seems like a good and obvious thing to do, but typically photos and product materials in our space are produced by teams without direct experience helping customers make CPAP equipment work for them. We often find that the stock images and materials available to us are ineffective for internet customers, as they are often designed to target physicians and the owners of traditional brick and mortar CPAP retailers. We have spent a lot of time and effort to do better. I believe we have. Our product presentations are end CPAP user driven and focused. We view both the images produced and the knowledge that produced them as an earned competitive advantage. We've had instances where we woke up to find anothercpapco.com copying our product catalog verbatim. I think software patents slow innovation and that the DRM situation in the music industry is bad. Yet, I made the decision to water mark our images in order to prove them stolen.
- drcube 13y ago
  > If we publish our home brewed content without watermarks and it is lifted off google and used to compete against us, we have no effective recourse. Sure you do. Compete back. Preferably on price and quality of your product rather than the prettiness of your pictures. Anyone can take a picture of a CPAP machine. Yours aren't special, and if that's what's harming your business, you're doing something wrong. Probably a lot of things.
  - johnnyg 13y ago
    We do compete in those areas as well. Anyone can take a picture of a CPAP machine but not every can do so after 5 years experience serving customers using them. What angles do they want to see, what zoom shots make things most clear, how do those zooms relate to the specific features and usage of that machine/mask/product. CPAP is unfamiliar and visuals are the guide. It is important to do it right and hard to do it right. I think they are special as are the people who made them.
  - bendauphinee 13y ago
    As to the "prettiness" of photography, it is special. If I take a snapshot of a product with my camera-phone and post it, versus a well-staged photo with pro equipment and lighting, I can guarantee as a photographer that the higher quality photo will sell more product, all else being equal. Decent photography has a real-world cost attached to it. Why should the fact that anyone else can do it be a reason I give it away for free, with no attribution?
    - drcube 13y ago
      Lots of things have a real world cost to them, that doesn't mean everything that costs anyone anything to make or do should be restricted and withheld from the public. Presumably there was a cost to figuring out the angles and zooms that showed these machines in the most informative way. Do you think that particular, informed camera setup should be patented? If not, why should the particular photographs be copyrighted or otherwise excluded from use? Presumably when setting up your business (or the OP's), they looked to other more successful businesses as an example to follow. Should those other businesses be compensated for contributing to the OP's success? What makes one idea, or expression of an idea, exclusive, private property, while other, often more valuable ideas, are free for the taking? Sounds to me like the OP is trying to suppress competition through rent seeking, rather than competing on an even playing field by providing more value to the customer.
      - commentzorro 13y ago
        It's not about patents, angles, lighting, or whatever. Anyone is free to take as close as they can to the exact same shot. It's just that that person also has to pay the costs for that image too and not just take them from the OP.
- robryk 13y ago
  Why do you want the watermarks to be visible? ig1's suggestion of invisible ones should work just as well for proving that a particular image got copied from you.
  - bendauphinee 13y ago
    Visual watermarks are a deterrent to theft. If I find two similar images, and one has a watermark I'll have to edit out, which am I picking? Unless the one without the watermark is terrible, I'm taking it.

Can you explain in more detail? I am actually curious, because as a customer I hate the watermarks. Do you think they help with brand awareness, or driving traffic to your own site?

johnnyg 13y ago

Summary: If we publish our home brewed content without watermarks and it is lifted off google and used to compete against us, we have no effective recourse. Detail: In our company, one advancement track is from Customer Service to Products. It seems like a good and obvious thing to do, but typically photos and product materials in our space are produced by teams without direct experience helping customers make CPAP equipment work for them. We often find that the stock images and materials available to us are ineffective for internet customers, as they are often designed to target physicians and the owners of traditional brick and mortar CPAP retailers. We have spent a lot of time and effort to do better. I believe we have. Our product presentations are end CPAP user driven and focused. We view both the images produced and the knowledge that produced them as an earned competitive advantage. We've had instances where we woke up to find anothercpapco.com copying our product catalog verbatim. I think software patents slow innovation and that the DRM situation in the music industry is bad. Yet, I made the decision to water mark our images in order to prove them stolen.

drcube 13y ago
> If we publish our home brewed content without watermarks and it is lifted off google and used to compete against us, we have no effective recourse. Sure you do. Compete back. Preferably on price and quality of your product rather than the prettiness of your pictures. Anyone can take a picture of a CPAP machine. Yours aren't special, and if that's what's harming your business, you're doing something wrong. Probably a lot of things.
- johnnyg 13y ago
  We do compete in those areas as well. Anyone can take a picture of a CPAP machine but not every can do so after 5 years experience serving customers using them. What angles do they want to see, what zoom shots make things most clear, how do those zooms relate to the specific features and usage of that machine/mask/product. CPAP is unfamiliar and visuals are the guide. It is important to do it right and hard to do it right. I think they are special as are the people who made them.
- bendauphinee 13y ago
  As to the "prettiness" of photography, it is special. If I take a snapshot of a product with my camera-phone and post it, versus a well-staged photo with pro equipment and lighting, I can guarantee as a photographer that the higher quality photo will sell more product, all else being equal. Decent photography has a real-world cost attached to it. Why should the fact that anyone else can do it be a reason I give it away for free, with no attribution?
  - drcube 13y ago
    Lots of things have a real world cost to them, that doesn't mean everything that costs anyone anything to make or do should be restricted and withheld from the public. Presumably there was a cost to figuring out the angles and zooms that showed these machines in the most informative way. Do you think that particular, informed camera setup should be patented? If not, why should the particular photographs be copyrighted or otherwise excluded from use? Presumably when setting up your business (or the OP's), they looked to other more successful businesses as an example to follow. Should those other businesses be compensated for contributing to the OP's success? What makes one idea, or expression of an idea, exclusive, private property, while other, often more valuable ideas, are free for the taking? Sounds to me like the OP is trying to suppress competition through rent seeking, rather than competing on an even playing field by providing more value to the customer.
    - commentzorro 13y ago
      It's not about patents, angles, lighting, or whatever. Anyone is free to take as close as they can to the exact same shot. It's just that that person also has to pay the costs for that image too and not just take them from the OP.
robryk 13y ago
Why do you want the watermarks to be visible? ig1's suggestion of invisible ones should work just as well for proving that a particular image got copied from you.
- bendauphinee 13y ago
  Visual watermarks are a deterrent to theft. If I find two similar images, and one has a watermark I'll have to edit out, which am I picking? Unless the one without the watermark is terrible, I'm taking it.