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The author implies that everyone is smart. This is false. On average, everyone is of average intelligence. The entire population lies either below or above a

The author implies that everyone is smart. This is false. On average, everyone is of average intelligence. The entire population lies either below or above average. Not everyone is capable of being a software engineer, and people like Barack Obama need to focus on helping people do well at whatever it is they can do well at (rather than trying to churn out a bunch of burdensome code monkeys).

fragsworth 13y ago
> Not everyone is capable of being a software engineer Bullshit. This is a very narcissistic view that lots of programmers have. I think you have this belief because it helps you enjoy feeling superior to non-programmers. If a person can learn how to read and write, then they can learn how to program. It just takes time and effort, and some people can learn it faster than others. But just about anyone can do it. The only things holding them back are their priorities and misconceptions.
- thedufer 13y ago
  You should read http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2006/07/separating-programming-sheep-from-non-programming-goats.html http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2006/07/separating-programm... (or the linked paper, if you want something heavier). Maybe everyone can learn to code, but the research says that a portion of the population (on the order of half) isn't wired to think that way, and at least would take orders of magnitude more time to learn (if they can at all). I'm by no means claiming that this segment of the population is more or less intelligent than the rest, but to make claims like "everyone can learn to program" is to ignore the realities of the classroom.
- RussianCow 13y ago
  It's not about intelligence--some people's brains just aren't wired in a way that would make them any good at software development. That doesn't mean that they couldn't ever learn how to write code given enough time, but not everyone has unlimited time and will power to do that. So in theory, yes, anyone could learn to code. In practice, it doesn't work out that way.
  - nfoz 13y ago
    "brains being wired" -- this is a failed analogy, since brains are extremely changeable ("plastic", another weak analogy).
  - pessimizer 13y ago
    >some people's brains just aren't wired in a way that would make them any good at software development. People say this a lot. That is the entirety of the evidence for it. I have yet to meet someone in a context in which they actually wanted to program who didn't have the ability. Programming isn't hard, hard programming is hard, because it usually requires hard math and deep abstraction. In those cases, though, the programming is the easiest part - it's pencil to notebook that's frustrating.
    - thedufer 13y ago
      > People say this a lot. That is the entirety of the evidence for it. "I haven't seen the evidence" is hardly synonymous with "there isn't any": http://www.eis.mdx.ac.uk/research/PhDArea/saeed/paper1.pdf http://www.eis.mdx.ac.uk/research/PhDArea/saeed/paper1.pdf
  - fragsworth 13y ago
    > some people's brains just aren't wired in a way that would make them any good at software development. I've worked in education with enough people to understand this situation very well. There's an initial "hump" that you have to get over, the very first time you are learning how to program. It involves wrapping your head around a few dozen distinct concepts and how they can interact. For some people, it takes a few days, and for others, it takes a few weeks or months. This is usually based on how much prior exposure they've had to programming - how much they tinkered with it before trying to learn it formally. Anyway, after that hump, people feel confident that they can learn to do anything in the world of programming. In my experience, the only people who failed to reach this point were the ones who did not dedicate a reasonable amount of time. Once you get over those initial concepts, your skill level is really just a matter of how much experience you've had. The ones that learned the initial concepts in a few days are not necessarily better than the ones who took a few months.
- HeyLaughingBoy 13y ago
  I, personally, have that belief from having been a CS101 tutor in college. I majored in EE and had lots of EE classmates who found programming to be extremely mentally taxing and absolutely hated it. I worked with otherwise very bright students who could not grasp the concept of taking a problem and decomposing it into discrete steps. Some people's brains simply don't want to work that way. They can solve the problem just fine, but not in a way that a computer could process.
  - webmaven 13y ago
    That seems to apply mostly to imperative languages. What about declarative ones?
etjossem 13y ago
> The author implies that everyone is smart. No, the author is saying that software engineering is currently viewed (even by smart and capable people) as an intellectually intimidating profession. There's no reason why that should be the case. Working in this space doesn't require you to have exceptional intelligence; just a willingness to apply yourself to the task and think in terms of certain logical patterns. At no point does the writer try to imply that everyone is smarter than average - that's silly.

fragsworth 13y ago

> Not everyone is capable of being a software engineer Bullshit. This is a very narcissistic view that lots of programmers have. I think you have this belief because it helps you enjoy feeling superior to non-programmers. If a person can learn how to read and write, then they can learn how to program. It just takes time and effort, and some people can learn it faster than others. But just about anyone can do it. The only things holding them back are their priorities and misconceptions.

thedufer 13y ago
You should read http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2006/07/separating-programming-sheep-from-non-programming-goats.html http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2006/07/separating-programm... (or the linked paper, if you want something heavier). Maybe everyone can learn to code, but the research says that a portion of the population (on the order of half) isn't wired to think that way, and at least would take orders of magnitude more time to learn (if they can at all). I'm by no means claiming that this segment of the population is more or less intelligent than the rest, but to make claims like "everyone can learn to program" is to ignore the realities of the classroom.
RussianCow 13y ago
It's not about intelligence--some people's brains just aren't wired in a way that would make them any good at software development. That doesn't mean that they couldn't ever learn how to write code given enough time, but not everyone has unlimited time and will power to do that. So in theory, yes, anyone could learn to code. In practice, it doesn't work out that way.
- nfoz 13y ago
  "brains being wired" -- this is a failed analogy, since brains are extremely changeable ("plastic", another weak analogy).
- pessimizer 13y ago
  >some people's brains just aren't wired in a way that would make them any good at software development. People say this a lot. That is the entirety of the evidence for it. I have yet to meet someone in a context in which they actually wanted to program who didn't have the ability. Programming isn't hard, hard programming is hard, because it usually requires hard math and deep abstraction. In those cases, though, the programming is the easiest part - it's pencil to notebook that's frustrating.
  - thedufer 13y ago
    > People say this a lot. That is the entirety of the evidence for it. "I haven't seen the evidence" is hardly synonymous with "there isn't any": http://www.eis.mdx.ac.uk/research/PhDArea/saeed/paper1.pdf http://www.eis.mdx.ac.uk/research/PhDArea/saeed/paper1.pdf
- fragsworth 13y ago
  > some people's brains just aren't wired in a way that would make them any good at software development. I've worked in education with enough people to understand this situation very well. There's an initial "hump" that you have to get over, the very first time you are learning how to program. It involves wrapping your head around a few dozen distinct concepts and how they can interact. For some people, it takes a few days, and for others, it takes a few weeks or months. This is usually based on how much prior exposure they've had to programming - how much they tinkered with it before trying to learn it formally. Anyway, after that hump, people feel confident that they can learn to do anything in the world of programming. In my experience, the only people who failed to reach this point were the ones who did not dedicate a reasonable amount of time. Once you get over those initial concepts, your skill level is really just a matter of how much experience you've had. The ones that learned the initial concepts in a few days are not necessarily better than the ones who took a few months.
HeyLaughingBoy 13y ago
I, personally, have that belief from having been a CS101 tutor in college. I majored in EE and had lots of EE classmates who found programming to be extremely mentally taxing and absolutely hated it. I worked with otherwise very bright students who could not grasp the concept of taking a problem and decomposing it into discrete steps. Some people's brains simply don't want to work that way. They can solve the problem just fine, but not in a way that a computer could process.
- webmaven 13y ago
  That seems to apply mostly to imperative languages. What about declarative ones?

etjossem 13y ago

> The author implies that everyone is smart. No, the author is saying that software engineering is currently viewed (even by smart and capable people) as an intellectually intimidating profession. There's no reason why that should be the case. Working in this space doesn't require you to have exceptional intelligence; just a willingness to apply yourself to the task and think in terms of certain logical patterns. At no point does the writer try to imply that everyone is smarter than average - that's silly.