7 ms·

Riding bikes is super dangerous. I always slow down and give bikes a lot of space. I also think bike riders should ride on slower, non-busy roads whenever possi

by leokun 13y ago

Riding bikes is super dangerous. I always slow down and give bikes a lot of space. I also think bike riders should ride on slower, non-busy roads whenever possible, but I'm not at all blaming bike riders.

mikegreco 13y ago
This doesn't really tell the whole story. Riding bikes is dangerous, but the real danger here is driving a car. When you're driving a car you are in charge of a multi-thousand pound hunk of metal with more momentum than most people can even comprehend, and the slightest jerk of a wheel can send it careening off in a completely different direction in milliseconds. On a bike or walking with your own two feet, you're always in danger when the operator of a car isn't performing their due responsibilities. To Sivers, I'm sorry for your loss. This article is an inspiration, and a remarkably poignant commentary on how to best make use of our fleeting time.
- acjohnson55 13y ago
  Gotta agree with you here. Maybe with more intelligent car systems and advancements in mass transit, the future can be brighter and safer.
jseliger 13y ago
Riding bikes is super dangerous Without some pretty sophisticated data, I'm not sure this is true. About 30,000 people die in car accidents every year, which I wrote more about here: http://blog.seliger.com/2013/11/10/foundations-give-away-five-percent-of-their-assets-a-year-typhoon-haiyan-shows-why-you-should-act-now-not-later/ http://blog.seliger.com/2013/11/10/foundations-give-away-fiv... . I don't know how many died on bikes or how many miles people bike versus how many they drive. But car accidents are so common that even deaths often don't register on the news. There's also an interesting question about the effects of biking and other exercise on health; riding may have salutary health benefits that driving doesn't. I don't know of any studies that examine such effects but would be happy to see any studies on the issue.
- diziet 13y ago
  The injury rate per mile is about 2.5x higher while cycling vs riding a car, though low on a per hour basis. Bicycle: .039 fatalities per million miles Car: .016 fatalities per million miles http://www.bellboycott.com/cached/www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/health/risks.htm http://www.bellboycott.com/cached/www.kenkifer.com/bikepages... I think the biggest problem is the lack of control. If someone makes a mistake, has a seizure, loses control etc, and crashes into a cyclist, the cyclist has less 'protection' around them.
  - hdevalence 13y ago
    It would be interesting to see numbers for a country like the Netherlands that actually has cycling infrastructure.
    - Munksgaard 13y ago
      Here's some data for Denmark: According to [0], 22 people were killed on bicycles in 2012. Compare that to 81 for an ordinary car, 31 pedestrians and 11 on a motorcycle. Accoring to [1], bike rides make up 16% of all trips in Denmark, but only 3.6% of the actual number of kilometers travelled (which isn't really surprising). According to [2], car rides make up 46% of all trips. So even though the number of car rides are only almost 3 times bigger than the number of bike rides, the number of fatal accidents are actually almost 4 times bigger. Edit: Oh, passengers aren't included in the 46%. They make up 12% according to [2]. So my last point isn't completely valid, its more like they're equally fatal. [0]: http://www.statbank.dk/ http://www.statbank.dk/ [1]: http://www.modelcenter.transport.dtu.dk/Transportvaneundersoegelsen/TU-udgivelser/Faktaark-om-cykeltrafik-i-Danmark-2012 http://www.modelcenter.transport.dtu.dk/Transportvaneunderso... [2]: http://www.modelcenter.transport.dtu.dk/Transportvaneundersoegelsen/TU-udgivelser/TU-rapport-om-danskernes-transportvaner-2012 http://www.modelcenter.transport.dtu.dk/Transportvaneunderso...
      - colomon 13y ago
        Am I missing something? If bike kilometers are 3.6% of car kilometers, then aren't there 25x the car kilometers and only 4x the car fatalities?
Widdershin 13y ago
I'm curious as to what the point you are trying to make is.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
corresation 13y ago
"On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero." This was a cyclist doing, by all accounts, everything absolutely and completely right. Speculation is absolutely useless if not crass right now given this terrible, unnecessary loss, but historic odds favor the driver (an officer) being distracted in some manner, which is a growing concern that everyone in this industry needs to keep in mind.
- melling 13y ago
  Yes, speculation is useless. Remove the speculation and let drivers know that any incident will be recorded then everyone will stay away from cyclists.
moocowduckquack 13y ago
Depends how you count. Per mile, cycling is safer than walking. http://road.cc/content/news/68212-dft-casualty-statistics-rank-driving-cycling-walking-and-motorcycling-risk http://road.cc/content/news/68212-dft-casualty-statistics-ra...
malandrew 13y ago
I pretty much never get angry, but if I am a passenger in a car where the driver acts aggressively towards pedestrians or bicyclists, I totally lose my shit. Part of getting drivers to behave better is to provide disparagement of driving aggressively from within their own car. You'd be surprised how many drivers are completely non-chalant to actively dismissive of the care and attention they should pay to others on the road not protected by a 6000 lb metal shell. That metal shell fosters road rage and road carelessness by disconnecting the drivers from the world around them. However, that metal shell won't protect them from being judged by their passengers.
bowlofpetunias 13y ago
Riding bikes is only dangerous in countries where murdering cyclists is apparently okay. I found the account of the accident shocking. Of course being from the Netherlands I'm extremely biased, but from my perspective these kind of American "driver kills cyclist" accidents I keep reading are as insane as "accidentally" killing someone whilst "accidentally" pointing a loaded gun at their heads. Even with a car it's hard to kill a cyclist by accident, unless the accident results in a very unlucky fall.
- tripzilch 13y ago
  ... and to think we don't even wear helmets on our bikes. And it's not that Dutch skulls happen to be tougher.
Steltek 13y ago
Having cars around is super dangerous. It's rare for a cyclist or pedestrian to just trip themselves and fall over dead. It takes a car with a negligent or ioditic driver to run them over (and consequently, not get prosecuted because it's implied that the cyclist had it coming!). Take away the cars and instantaneously, we would eliminates hundreds of thousands of deaths. Factor in increased exercise and it's almost laughable that we're not doing this.
agilebyte 13y ago
Was going through stats the other day to see when is it more dangerous: 1) Under low light conditions 2) When trucks are around 3) When said trucks turn left and you are going straight (for people cycling/driving on the left) No surprises there.

by leokun 13y ago

mikegreco 13y ago

This doesn't really tell the whole story. Riding bikes is dangerous, but the real danger here is driving a car. When you're driving a car you are in charge of a multi-thousand pound hunk of metal with more momentum than most people can even comprehend, and the slightest jerk of a wheel can send it careening off in a completely different direction in milliseconds. On a bike or walking with your own two feet, you're always in danger when the operator of a car isn't performing their due responsibilities. To Sivers, I'm sorry for your loss. This article is an inspiration, and a remarkably poignant commentary on how to best make use of our fleeting time.

acjohnson55 13y ago
Gotta agree with you here. Maybe with more intelligent car systems and advancements in mass transit, the future can be brighter and safer.

jseliger 13y ago

Riding bikes is super dangerous Without some pretty sophisticated data, I'm not sure this is true. About 30,000 people die in car accidents every year, which I wrote more about here: http://blog.seliger.com/2013/11/10/foundations-give-away-five-percent-of-their-assets-a-year-typhoon-haiyan-shows-why-you-should-act-now-not-later/ http://blog.seliger.com/2013/11/10/foundations-give-away-fiv... . I don't know how many died on bikes or how many miles people bike versus how many they drive. But car accidents are so common that even deaths often don't register on the news. There's also an interesting question about the effects of biking and other exercise on health; riding may have salutary health benefits that driving doesn't. I don't know of any studies that examine such effects but would be happy to see any studies on the issue.

diziet 13y ago
The injury rate per mile is about 2.5x higher while cycling vs riding a car, though low on a per hour basis. Bicycle: .039 fatalities per million miles Car: .016 fatalities per million miles http://www.bellboycott.com/cached/www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/health/risks.htm http://www.bellboycott.com/cached/www.kenkifer.com/bikepages... I think the biggest problem is the lack of control. If someone makes a mistake, has a seizure, loses control etc, and crashes into a cyclist, the cyclist has less 'protection' around them.
- hdevalence 13y ago
  It would be interesting to see numbers for a country like the Netherlands that actually has cycling infrastructure.
  - Munksgaard 13y ago
    Here's some data for Denmark: According to [0], 22 people were killed on bicycles in 2012. Compare that to 81 for an ordinary car, 31 pedestrians and 11 on a motorcycle. Accoring to [1], bike rides make up 16% of all trips in Denmark, but only 3.6% of the actual number of kilometers travelled (which isn't really surprising). According to [2], car rides make up 46% of all trips. So even though the number of car rides are only almost 3 times bigger than the number of bike rides, the number of fatal accidents are actually almost 4 times bigger. Edit: Oh, passengers aren't included in the 46%. They make up 12% according to [2]. So my last point isn't completely valid, its more like they're equally fatal. [0]: http://www.statbank.dk/ http://www.statbank.dk/ [1]: http://www.modelcenter.transport.dtu.dk/Transportvaneundersoegelsen/TU-udgivelser/Faktaark-om-cykeltrafik-i-Danmark-2012 http://www.modelcenter.transport.dtu.dk/Transportvaneunderso... [2]: http://www.modelcenter.transport.dtu.dk/Transportvaneundersoegelsen/TU-udgivelser/TU-rapport-om-danskernes-transportvaner-2012 http://www.modelcenter.transport.dtu.dk/Transportvaneunderso...
    - colomon 13y ago
      Am I missing something? If bike kilometers are 3.6% of car kilometers, then aren't there 25x the car kilometers and only 4x the car fatalities?

Widdershin 13y ago

I'm curious as to what the point you are trying to make is.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

corresation 13y ago

"On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero." This was a cyclist doing, by all accounts, everything absolutely and completely right. Speculation is absolutely useless if not crass right now given this terrible, unnecessary loss, but historic odds favor the driver (an officer) being distracted in some manner, which is a growing concern that everyone in this industry needs to keep in mind.

melling 13y ago
Yes, speculation is useless. Remove the speculation and let drivers know that any incident will be recorded then everyone will stay away from cyclists.

moocowduckquack 13y ago

Depends how you count. Per mile, cycling is safer than walking. http://road.cc/content/news/68212-dft-casualty-statistics-rank-driving-cycling-walking-and-motorcycling-risk http://road.cc/content/news/68212-dft-casualty-statistics-ra...

malandrew 13y ago

I pretty much never get angry, but if I am a passenger in a car where the driver acts aggressively towards pedestrians or bicyclists, I totally lose my shit. Part of getting drivers to behave better is to provide disparagement of driving aggressively from within their own car. You'd be surprised how many drivers are completely non-chalant to actively dismissive of the care and attention they should pay to others on the road not protected by a 6000 lb metal shell. That metal shell fosters road rage and road carelessness by disconnecting the drivers from the world around them. However, that metal shell won't protect them from being judged by their passengers.

bowlofpetunias 13y ago

Riding bikes is only dangerous in countries where murdering cyclists is apparently okay. I found the account of the accident shocking. Of course being from the Netherlands I'm extremely biased, but from my perspective these kind of American "driver kills cyclist" accidents I keep reading are as insane as "accidentally" killing someone whilst "accidentally" pointing a loaded gun at their heads. Even with a car it's hard to kill a cyclist by accident, unless the accident results in a very unlucky fall.

tripzilch 13y ago
... and to think we don't even wear helmets on our bikes. And it's not that Dutch skulls happen to be tougher.

Steltek 13y ago

Having cars around is super dangerous. It's rare for a cyclist or pedestrian to just trip themselves and fall over dead. It takes a car with a negligent or ioditic driver to run them over (and consequently, not get prosecuted because it's implied that the cyclist had it coming!). Take away the cars and instantaneously, we would eliminates hundreds of thousands of deaths. Factor in increased exercise and it's almost laughable that we're not doing this.

agilebyte 13y ago

Was going through stats the other day to see when is it more dangerous: 1) Under low light conditions 2) When trucks are around 3) When said trucks turn left and you are going straight (for people cycling/driving on the left) No surprises there.