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The examples you gave don't use Bitcoin; they all use USD. The currency itself is illegal; we're not even talking about what you're doing with the currency. Bit

The examples you gave don't use Bitcoin; they all use USD. The currency itself is illegal; we're not even talking about what you're doing with the currency. Bitcoin's legality is disputed in China, Thailand, and the state of California. Since Apple operates out of California, it makes sense that they would hesitate to allow such functionality on their apps. Edit for clarity: I interpret "facilitates, enables, or encourages an activity – that is not legal in all the locations in which the app is available" to mean that the act of making a Bitcoin transaction is illegal in certain jurisdictions.

dmix 13y ago
It's not illegal to transfer money as a consumer with Bitcoin in California or the other places you mentioned. It's just illegal to do so without proper licencing if you run a financial business. Apple is just offering an app marketplace, they are not hosting BTC transfers or running a money-transfer business by letting Gliph be in the app store.
yeldarb 13y ago
Illegal and "disputed legality" are two entirely different beasts. If the legality is disputed that is for a court to decide, not Apple. In regard to China specifically they explicitly said last week that it is still legal for private Chinese citizens to use Bitcoin.
- patmcc 13y ago
  Apple isn't deciding the legality, they're refusing to allow something of "disputed legality" into the store they run. Would you be mad at Walmart for not selling a new supplement that was of "disputed legality"?
  - maxerickson 13y ago
    I find Walmart's decision not to carry music with explicit lyrics similarly tiresome to Apple's quest to defend their users from installing things. (But both issues are easily sidestepped so I don't care very much...)
  - DanBC 13y ago
    Reddit has content that is clearly, unambiguously, illegal in the UK. There are apps to access Reddit in the app store.
    - reginaldjcooper 13y ago
      What like cyberbullying? Genuinely curious.
      - DanBC 13y ago
        Reddit has a pro-suicide sub reddit. It is illegal for people in England to aid someone who is attempting suicide. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Eliz2/9-10/60 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Eliz2/9-10/60 > Criminal liability for complicity in another’s suicide. > (1)A person who aids, abets, counsels or procures the suicide of another, or an attempt by another to commit suicide, shall be liable on conviction on indictment to imprisonment for a term not exceeding fourteen years. This law is mostly used to prevent more active assistance in suicide, but it is also used to prevent people giving advice about how to complete suicide. So, that's one current sub reddit. In the past there were jailbait subreddits. I never visited so I have no idea about the content, but English law is stricter than US law around images of people under the age of 18.
        reginaldjcooper 13y ago
        I only knew there was the /r/jailbait that got removed. A pro-suicide forum is an unsavory thing. Thanks for clarifying.
        epaga 13y ago
        Pro-suicide is tame compared to many of the subreddits out there. If you're curious, do NOT click the links in this collection but rather read the reactions of people who did. (I am serious). http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1qa5ff/what_is_the_most_disturbing_subreddit_you_have/ http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1qa5ff/what_is_th...
- rmrfrmrf 13y ago
  Apple can decide whatever it wants, especially if it's protecting themselves from being named in a multi-million dollar lawsuit.
  - GigabyteCoin 13y ago
    Which is exactly the problem here and the reason this headline is getting so much attention.
  - yeldarb 13y ago
    Sure. But they should do it transparently. Come out and say "our legal team thinks your app opens us up to the risk of a lawsuit." Not "Your app is illegal somewhere," when this claim is dubious at best.
mrb 13y ago
Stop spreading FUD. Bitcoin is, so far, perfectly legal. USA: “We all recognize that virtual currencies, in and of themselves, are not illegal,” Mythili Raman, acting assistant attorney general at the Justice Department’s criminal division, said at the hearing. Source: http://seattletimes.com/html/businesstechnology/2022288065_bitcoinssenatexml.html http://seattletimes.com/html/businesstechnology/2022288065_b... China: "The People’s Bank of China [...] has stopped short of banning the world’s most popular digital currency outright". IOW they still allow people to trade bitcoins, if they wish to. Source: http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/12/china_bank/ http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/12/china_bank/ Thailand: the Bank of Thailand may display an anti-Bitcoin stance, but they have no legislative power to declare Bitcoin illegal: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=264389.0;all https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=264389.0;all
- yapcguy 13y ago
  Exactly. When Bitcoin interacts with existing financial services, the regulator may decide to not allow those interactions to occur. This is no reflection on Bitcoin itself which is not illegal.
biafra 13y ago
Then why not allow the app in locations where Bitcoin is known to be legal? Like Germany? I guess there are some countries where the legality of Bitcoin is not disputed. The App Store allows to restrict the apps availability by country. To me it is clear that Apple tries to stifle adoption and innovation in the Bitcoin area by disallowing those apps on their platform.

dmix 13y ago

It's not illegal to transfer money as a consumer with Bitcoin in California or the other places you mentioned. It's just illegal to do so without proper licencing if you run a financial business. Apple is just offering an app marketplace, they are not hosting BTC transfers or running a money-transfer business by letting Gliph be in the app store.

yeldarb 13y ago

Illegal and "disputed legality" are two entirely different beasts. If the legality is disputed that is for a court to decide, not Apple. In regard to China specifically they explicitly said last week that it is still legal for private Chinese citizens to use Bitcoin.

patmcc 13y ago
Apple isn't deciding the legality, they're refusing to allow something of "disputed legality" into the store they run. Would you be mad at Walmart for not selling a new supplement that was of "disputed legality"?
- maxerickson 13y ago
  I find Walmart's decision not to carry music with explicit lyrics similarly tiresome to Apple's quest to defend their users from installing things. (But both issues are easily sidestepped so I don't care very much...)
- DanBC 13y ago
  Reddit has content that is clearly, unambiguously, illegal in the UK. There are apps to access Reddit in the app store.
  - reginaldjcooper 13y ago
    What like cyberbullying? Genuinely curious.
    - DanBC 13y ago
      Reddit has a pro-suicide sub reddit. It is illegal for people in England to aid someone who is attempting suicide. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Eliz2/9-10/60 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Eliz2/9-10/60 > Criminal liability for complicity in another’s suicide. > (1)A person who aids, abets, counsels or procures the suicide of another, or an attempt by another to commit suicide, shall be liable on conviction on indictment to imprisonment for a term not exceeding fourteen years. This law is mostly used to prevent more active assistance in suicide, but it is also used to prevent people giving advice about how to complete suicide. So, that's one current sub reddit. In the past there were jailbait subreddits. I never visited so I have no idea about the content, but English law is stricter than US law around images of people under the age of 18.
      - reginaldjcooper 13y ago
        I only knew there was the /r/jailbait that got removed. A pro-suicide forum is an unsavory thing. Thanks for clarifying.
        epaga 13y ago
        Pro-suicide is tame compared to many of the subreddits out there. If you're curious, do NOT click the links in this collection but rather read the reactions of people who did. (I am serious). http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1qa5ff/what_is_the_most_disturbing_subreddit_you_have/ http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1qa5ff/what_is_th...
rmrfrmrf 13y ago
Apple can decide whatever it wants, especially if it's protecting themselves from being named in a multi-million dollar lawsuit.
- GigabyteCoin 13y ago
  Which is exactly the problem here and the reason this headline is getting so much attention.
- yeldarb 13y ago
  Sure. But they should do it transparently. Come out and say "our legal team thinks your app opens us up to the risk of a lawsuit." Not "Your app is illegal somewhere," when this claim is dubious at best.

mrb 13y ago

Stop spreading FUD. Bitcoin is, so far, perfectly legal. USA: “We all recognize that virtual currencies, in and of themselves, are not illegal,” Mythili Raman, acting assistant attorney general at the Justice Department’s criminal division, said at the hearing. Source: http://seattletimes.com/html/businesstechnology/2022288065_bitcoinssenatexml.html http://seattletimes.com/html/businesstechnology/2022288065_b... China: "The People’s Bank of China [...] has stopped short of banning the world’s most popular digital currency outright". IOW they still allow people to trade bitcoins, if they wish to. Source: http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/12/china_bank/ http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2013/12/china_bank/ Thailand: the Bank of Thailand may display an anti-Bitcoin stance, but they have no legislative power to declare Bitcoin illegal: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=264389.0;all https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=264389.0;all

yapcguy 13y ago
Exactly. When Bitcoin interacts with existing financial services, the regulator may decide to not allow those interactions to occur. This is no reflection on Bitcoin itself which is not illegal.

biafra 13y ago

Then why not allow the app in locations where Bitcoin is known to be legal? Like Germany? I guess there are some countries where the legality of Bitcoin is not disputed. The App Store allows to restrict the apps availability by country. To me it is clear that Apple tries to stifle adoption and innovation in the Bitcoin area by disallowing those apps on their platform.