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Even if you take the most high profile target in the last few years, Osama Bin Laden, you can see that he essentially lived in an electronic black hole. There w

by atonse 13y ago

Even if you take the most high profile target in the last few years, Osama Bin Laden, you can see that he essentially lived in an electronic black hole. There wasn't even an internet connection or phone line connected to the house he lived in. They'd also burn trash on-site so that it could not be intercepted. Bin Laden also stopped using Satellite phones after it was clear that the NSA et al were very easily eavesdropping on satellite phones. I don't have any specific sources but this is the sort of the stuff I've read over the years. Various terrorist groups have been aware of the general capabilities of Intelligence Agencies, whether they knew or understood the nuances of the technology is another thing. It's us citizens who are shocked about the overarching abuses, I'm sure the bad guys are the least shocked.

csandreasen 13y ago
Bin Laden did, which was probably why he was so difficult to track down. My understanding of the situation (correct me if I'm wrong) was that the rest of Al Qaeda and their affiliates were not as careful with their security. He might never be caught using an internet connection or cell phone, but it wouldn't necessarily matter if 90% of his organization did. Nuances would matter quite a bit, too. Bin Laden stopped using his satellite phone after he suspected that the NSA could listen. But what about the satellite phone made it insecure? The fact that uses satellites? Would a cell phone be susceptible? GSM? CDMA? Only Motorolas? Are land lines secure? What if they're encrypted? What encryption schemes are secure? I don't have the documents off hand, either (sorry), but from what I've heard their overall security was pretty lousy - I remember reading that they were doing things like rolling their own encryption.
- atonse 13y ago
  Oh that's not at all surprising that they tried to roll their own encryption. But if they are already not that sophisticated, then they'd still not be able to glean much value from these revelations. Surely someone rolling their own encryption doesn't understand the big deal with NSA's BULLRUN program (where they tried to weaken encryption algorithms by planting people in teams and attempted to weaken protocols, or target vulnerabilities in encryption libraries).

by atonse 13y ago

csandreasen 13y ago

Bin Laden did, which was probably why he was so difficult to track down. My understanding of the situation (correct me if I'm wrong) was that the rest of Al Qaeda and their affiliates were not as careful with their security. He might never be caught using an internet connection or cell phone, but it wouldn't necessarily matter if 90% of his organization did. Nuances would matter quite a bit, too. Bin Laden stopped using his satellite phone after he suspected that the NSA could listen. But what about the satellite phone made it insecure? The fact that uses satellites? Would a cell phone be susceptible? GSM? CDMA? Only Motorolas? Are land lines secure? What if they're encrypted? What encryption schemes are secure? I don't have the documents off hand, either (sorry), but from what I've heard their overall security was pretty lousy - I remember reading that they were doing things like rolling their own encryption.

atonse 13y ago
Oh that's not at all surprising that they tried to roll their own encryption. But if they are already not that sophisticated, then they'd still not be able to glean much value from these revelations. Surely someone rolling their own encryption doesn't understand the big deal with NSA's BULLRUN program (where they tried to weaken encryption algorithms by planting people in teams and attempted to weaken protocols, or target vulnerabilities in encryption libraries).