5 ms·

Britain’s Ministry of Nudges

43 points by RougeFemme 13y ago

Game_Ender 13y ago
It really makes you question the structure that puts in place the original polices this group "nudges". There needs to be an incentive structure in the government itself, that encourages every department to improve how they function continuously. You shouldn't have to create a special department that focus on one tiny portion of the government at once for improvement.
- csmuk 13y ago
  Well actually how it works is X knows that Lord Y hasn't got a position in the government at the moment so the funny hand shake club[1] gets together and comes up with a new position. In this case the Ministry of Nudges with chief nudger, a whole staff of public servants, a budget, and a whole pile of expenses like duck houses. [1] masons, Eton alumni etc.
  - lsc 13y ago
    Are the masons still a thing? I know it was a big deal back in the day, but none of the masons I know (well, that I know are masons; I'm not one myself) are as well-connected as, say, I am.
    - csmuk 13y ago
      Yeah I actually posted that from inside a masonic Lodge ironically (dinner party that was basically a throw back to 1970). I'm not a mason but one of my relatives is. Have escaped now, thank fuck. Masons still tend to be well connected in traditional professions if they admit it or not and they do leverage their connection regularly. The appearance I get is that they are downplaying themselves as a "happy little drinking club" rather than a formal organisation. The basic promise of the masons is that they will always put another mason first. That first means before the law and before ethics. I've witnessed this (with respect to the law). They can make your life very difficult if they want to so I'm keeping out of their business past the formality.
      - lsc 13y ago
        >Masons still tend to be well connected in traditional professions if they admit it or not and they do leverage their connection regularly. The appearance I get is that they are downplaying themselves as a "happy little drinking club" rather than a formal organisation. Huh. I totally bought the "happy little drinking club" story - maybe I was too distracted trying to come up with a proper William Morgan joke.
        csmuk 13y ago
        I came up with numerous jokes today (not William Morgan ;-) but my relative is entirely devoid of a sense of humor.
      - JoeAltmaier 13y ago
        Sour grapes has to be part of this...
- DanBC 13y ago
  > It really makes you question the structure that puts in place the original polices this group "nudges". Nudge is a new thing. Hopefully it'll get baked into all current and future policy planning, along with good evidence bases and proper science. We've had laws and regulations piled on for many many years, so they do need a bit of fixing. And sometimes it's better to use a nudge ("We'll help clear your attic!") than impose a new law ("Insulate or face a fine"). Having a single department focus on little things now is a useful exercise to demonstrate to all the bureaucrats that nudging is real and works, and needs to be implemented.
trekky1700 13y ago
I much prefer the Ministry of Silly Walks.
- lovemenot 13y ago
  Say no more.
widdershins 13y ago
I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand, I like the somewhat scientific approach to the little things that government does - I think that approach is sorely lacking in many areas of government. On the other, just the idea of governments using behavioral science to 'herd' us is a little worrying. To be honest though, I don't find that nearly as worrying as the idea that such small differences in the phrasing of a letter, for example, can have so much influence on the decisions we make.
- orph 13y ago
  This already happens today in the form of PSA and the Ad Council. See http://www.adcouncil.org/Our-Work/Current-Work http://www.adcouncil.org/Our-Work/Current-Work for a sampling.
- walshemj 13y ago
  Ah you mean when many "nudges" are pandering to the prejudices of the tabloid press and UKIP? Some of these nudges have unplesent side effects the bed room tax has lead to several suicides.
  - DanBC 13y ago
    The bedroom tax is not a nudge. Cultural note: UK has a benefit called "Housing benefit". It pays rent for people in certain circumstances. Years ago people renting from a private landlord had limits imposed about the size of property they could rent - they were not allowed to be over accommodated. (Or they could be, but they wouldn't get that rate for the property and they'd need to make up the difference). Recently this rule has been applied to people renting from the public sector - local council housing and housing association properties. In theory it creates liquidity in the property market, and makes sure people are in the right size homes and getting the right amount of benefit. In practice people who can only afford to live in council housing cannot afford to move, even if there were other properties available for them. (And there usually aren't, and even less so now that so many people are looking to move.) In this situation a nudge would be finding the sticking point of why people stay in properties with too many rooms and finding a way to help them move. Offering to ebay extra possessions, allowing them to fit into a smaller home, would be a nudge. Offering help with removal vans or other logistics might be a nudge. Cutting benefit to poor people is a kludge.
hiharryhere 13y ago
Most of it is just A/B testing infringement notices: "The wording of letters sent to those owing income tax was changed to inform them that most people in their town had already lodged their return. Rewording letters has resulted in an extra £200 million ($290 million) being collected on time, practically cost-free." [1] A friend of mine works for a nudge unit within the New South Wales state Government in Australia, they're seeing some really interesting results. [1] http://www.smh.com.au/comment/what-a-difference-a-nudge-in-the-right-direction-can-make-20130406-2hdab.html http://www.smh.com.au/comment/what-a-difference-a-nudge-in-t...
ris 13y ago
I urge everyone to listen to this in counterpoint to the recent hype of nudge: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b02144zz http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b02144zz (may be IP-limited to uk, apologies)

43 points by RougeFemme 13y ago

It really makes you question the structure that puts in place the original polices this group "nudges". There needs to be an incentive structure in the government itself, that encourages every department to improve how they function continuously. You shouldn't have to create a special department that focus on one tiny portion of the government at once for improvement.

csmuk 13y ago
Well actually how it works is X knows that Lord Y hasn't got a position in the government at the moment so the funny hand shake club[1] gets together and comes up with a new position. In this case the Ministry of Nudges with chief nudger, a whole staff of public servants, a budget, and a whole pile of expenses like duck houses. [1] masons, Eton alumni etc.
- lsc 13y ago
  Are the masons still a thing? I know it was a big deal back in the day, but none of the masons I know (well, that I know are masons; I'm not one myself) are as well-connected as, say, I am.
  - csmuk 13y ago
    Yeah I actually posted that from inside a masonic Lodge ironically (dinner party that was basically a throw back to 1970). I'm not a mason but one of my relatives is. Have escaped now, thank fuck. Masons still tend to be well connected in traditional professions if they admit it or not and they do leverage their connection regularly. The appearance I get is that they are downplaying themselves as a "happy little drinking club" rather than a formal organisation. The basic promise of the masons is that they will always put another mason first. That first means before the law and before ethics. I've witnessed this (with respect to the law). They can make your life very difficult if they want to so I'm keeping out of their business past the formality.
    - lsc 13y ago
      >Masons still tend to be well connected in traditional professions if they admit it or not and they do leverage their connection regularly. The appearance I get is that they are downplaying themselves as a "happy little drinking club" rather than a formal organisation. Huh. I totally bought the "happy little drinking club" story - maybe I was too distracted trying to come up with a proper William Morgan joke.
      - csmuk 13y ago
        I came up with numerous jokes today (not William Morgan ;-) but my relative is entirely devoid of a sense of humor.
    - JoeAltmaier 13y ago
      Sour grapes has to be part of this...
DanBC 13y ago
> It really makes you question the structure that puts in place the original polices this group "nudges". Nudge is a new thing. Hopefully it'll get baked into all current and future policy planning, along with good evidence bases and proper science. We've had laws and regulations piled on for many many years, so they do need a bit of fixing. And sometimes it's better to use a nudge ("We'll help clear your attic!") than impose a new law ("Insulate or face a fine"). Having a single department focus on little things now is a useful exercise to demonstrate to all the bureaucrats that nudging is real and works, and needs to be implemented.

trekky1700 13y ago

I much prefer the Ministry of Silly Walks.

lovemenot 13y ago
Say no more.

widdershins 13y ago

I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand, I like the somewhat scientific approach to the little things that government does - I think that approach is sorely lacking in many areas of government. On the other, just the idea of governments using behavioral science to 'herd' us is a little worrying. To be honest though, I don't find that nearly as worrying as the idea that such small differences in the phrasing of a letter, for example, can have so much influence on the decisions we make.

orph 13y ago
This already happens today in the form of PSA and the Ad Council. See http://www.adcouncil.org/Our-Work/Current-Work http://www.adcouncil.org/Our-Work/Current-Work for a sampling.
walshemj 13y ago
Ah you mean when many "nudges" are pandering to the prejudices of the tabloid press and UKIP? Some of these nudges have unplesent side effects the bed room tax has lead to several suicides.
- DanBC 13y ago
  The bedroom tax is not a nudge. Cultural note: UK has a benefit called "Housing benefit". It pays rent for people in certain circumstances. Years ago people renting from a private landlord had limits imposed about the size of property they could rent - they were not allowed to be over accommodated. (Or they could be, but they wouldn't get that rate for the property and they'd need to make up the difference). Recently this rule has been applied to people renting from the public sector - local council housing and housing association properties. In theory it creates liquidity in the property market, and makes sure people are in the right size homes and getting the right amount of benefit. In practice people who can only afford to live in council housing cannot afford to move, even if there were other properties available for them. (And there usually aren't, and even less so now that so many people are looking to move.) In this situation a nudge would be finding the sticking point of why people stay in properties with too many rooms and finding a way to help them move. Offering to ebay extra possessions, allowing them to fit into a smaller home, would be a nudge. Offering help with removal vans or other logistics might be a nudge. Cutting benefit to poor people is a kludge.

hiharryhere 13y ago

Most of it is just A/B testing infringement notices: "The wording of letters sent to those owing income tax was changed to inform them that most people in their town had already lodged their return. Rewording letters has resulted in an extra £200 million ($290 million) being collected on time, practically cost-free." [1] A friend of mine works for a nudge unit within the New South Wales state Government in Australia, they're seeing some really interesting results. [1] http://www.smh.com.au/comment/what-a-difference-a-nudge-in-the-right-direction-can-make-20130406-2hdab.html http://www.smh.com.au/comment/what-a-difference-a-nudge-in-t...

ris 13y ago

I urge everyone to listen to this in counterpoint to the recent hype of nudge: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b02144zz http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b02144zz (may be IP-limited to uk, apologies)