4 ms·

Some things to do (and not do) if you aren't invited to interview with YC

49 points by jkush 19y ago

Having been here long enough to witness one funding cycle I'd like to offer some preemptive advice to those of you who aren't invited to interview in a few weeks. For the record, I did apply last round and was not invited. I did not apply for this funding cycle. 1). Don't take it personally. YC was kind enough to send a very nice email explaining that their decision wasn't personal. The email explained how their process is fraught with error. They were even nice enough to say there was a good chance they passed over promising groups of hackers. It's not personal and sometimes an application doesn't do justice to your abilities. 2). YC is not for everyone Sure, YC would make the whole startup process a lot easier and a lot more exciting, but you can still be very successful without YC. There are lots of successful companies out there that probably haven't even heard of YC. The honest truth is: being successful is completely in your control. 3). Don't write scathing blog posts After the decisions were made, a few people wrote scathing blog posts, designed to rip YC a new one. It doesn't work, it won't make you feel better and it just makes you look like an emotional train wreck. Don't air your dirty laundry. If you feel wronged or emotionally charged, refer to #1, then #2, then #4. 4). Shorten the cycle Eventually, the rejection will wear off and you'll get back to work. Some people might obsess for a few days, others a few weeks. Eventually though, you will get back to work on your ideas. If that's true, then why not shorten the cycle? Give yourself an hour to feel like crap (if that helps) then get back to work. I know many of you will see this advice as obvious, but when the email notifications go out it won't be. That's why I'm posting it now.

rkabir 19y ago
Before you hear back, you could do what we did - assume you got rejected. What would you do today if you knew you were rejected already? Hint: for bonus points, assume that YC is out to get you, and gives your brilliant idea[s] to some other shmucks. Strap down and build. Don't get bogged down in details.
DanielBMarkham 19y ago
Here's a bit of advice: be a startup junkie and not just a YC applicant. Startup junkies sill always follow startups: participating, sharing ideas, forming teams and making things happen. Being a startup junkie isn't something that is limited to any one funding cycle or organization. If you're a real junkie, YC is just a place to hang out while you're working on your own plans, which may have nothing to do with YC in the end. YC is just a tool which may or may not be available to you. If nothing else, you can monitor the board and listen while all kinds of cool stuff happens -- there's gold in being part of those conversations. Or as the old saying goes, "I've been kicked out of better places than this one"
- jkush 19y ago
  ...and that too!
garbowza 19y ago
Just like many of us have succeeded regardless of which college we went to (or were rejected by), we can also succeed regardless of whether we're accepted by YC. Sure YC will help tremendously in some cases, but ultimately there is no single path to success. Reacting positively to whatever is thrown at you, under any circumstances will inevitably lead to success.
antirez 19y ago
> but you can still be very successful without YC Sure, but let's face it, to be "under YC" makes you much more able to hit success, all the other things being the same. This is not exactly fair, but it's how things work.
- DanielBMarkham 19y ago
  So does being Bill Gates' cousin, winning the SuperBowl, saving a kid from a burning building, having good parents, etc. Some of this stuff is random, some of this stuff you can make happen, and some is a combination. YC is a combination. They're doing their best to figure out who to pick and you're doing your best to make your company work. Golden rule of being self-employed: NEVER focus on one opportunity or plan. Always have several things going. And be flexible about it. What's PG say their success rate is? Something like 50%? Sure -- it'd be great to be in a graduating class, but getting into YC is NOT like passing a test. You don't control it and even for the people who do control it, it's a crap shoot. It's more like bumping into some folks in the hall and chatting a bit and giving them your business card. Maybe they'll call. Maybe not. Don't get your hopes on it. How much can you really convey to somebody by bumping into them and chatting in the hall?
  - Alex3917 19y ago
    "How much can you really convey to somebody by bumping into them and chatting in the hall?" You can listen to what the other person has to say.
- Zak 19y ago
  The kind of people YC attempts to identify are the kind of people who will make it work with or without YC. If they're wrong about you, they'll regret it.
  - rms 19y ago
    here's hoping
pg 19y ago
Another thing I'd ask people not to do is write to us asking for the details of why they weren't invited. We explain in the YC FAQ that we won't, but every cycle people deluge us with emails anyway. It's not because we're being secretive that we don't answer these emails. The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some glaring flaw in the application, but simply because nothing in it jumped out at us.
- yarek 19y ago
  This reminds me of the application process to Yale. To get int you've got to be really good -- top of your class, top of the district. But, that's not enough - lots of people of that caliber apply. You've got to have something about your application that makes you stand out, that makes you special. You will simply stick in the recruiter's mind. And in this case, stickiness is good. It's the same thing when you're creating a startup -- you got to stand out.
  - nostrademons 19y ago
    Amherst does the same thing. However, Amherst's Dean of Admission then recites all the little factoids that stuck out at the regional receptions for admitted students. (This is always lampooned - hilariously - at the RC show, where upperclassmen put their own spin on it for incoming freshmen.) One of the factoids taken from my application was "One student took 8 AP tests, scoring 5s on 5 of them, without ever having taken an AP class." And I remember thinking, "What a dumb thing to fixate upon! My school didn't offer APs, so I couldn't take the courses. And the test was only $75 and could let me place out of several thousand dollars of college credit, so I'm not going to let something silly like not having taken the course stop me." My application had plenty of other impressive things on it, like starting a dot-com run exclusively by teenagers and watching it fail or placing tops in a couple of national math competitions. Yet what stuck out for them was the test scores. I guess the moral is to put down everything that might conceivably be impressive, because you never know what'll stick in the mind of the admissions person.
    - 19y ago
alaskamiller 19y ago
Well here's to my fourth attempt.
- deleted 19y ago
  [deleted]
- edw519 19y ago
  997 more and you'd be as persistent as Walt Disney. I bet you have an interesting story, alaskamiller. I imagine others here would like to hear it. Regardless of outcome this time, you should tell it here. I admire your tenacity. Good luck.
zandorg 19y ago
When I was rejected in November 2006, I sent a sarcastic (but not rude) email complaining about not being given a reason. However, I doubt anyone was offended. Anyway, I won't be doing that again.
- andreyf 19y ago
  I felt a little disappointed also, but Paul's point above makes sense: The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some glaring flaw in the application, but simply because nothing in it jumped out at us.
  - adrianwaj 19y ago
    I would expect that in a more perfect world PG (or an equivalent) would also say "We also like to give feedback and point out the things that would have made us more interested had it been included."
    - andreyf 19y ago
      How about: "There was no glaring flaw in your application, but nothing in it jumped out at us. Next time, do something that will impress us more."
    - sbraford 19y ago
      The common refrain from VCs, book publishers -- anyone who gets large volumes of submissions and can only select a tiny minority is: * even attempting to respond (however briefly) to the deluge of requests would overwhelm us to the point that we could no longer focus on running the core business
      - adrianwaj 19y ago
        But, if all publishers gave feedback then the 'poor' authors would each save themselves from submitting to multiple publishers, and the 'poor' publishers deluged with submissions would instead have more refined manuscripts to evaluate and in lesser numbers. Thus, a little feedback can go a long way. This is because ideally manuscripts would improve only after a few submissions due to the feedback given and then they would either be accepted for publishing, referred to a more appropriate publisher, or shelved due to uninterested publishers.
andreyf 19y ago
As great as YC and Paul Graham's writings are, and as much as they are helping create a extraordinary startup community, there will always be many ways to success in a tech startup. Take 37signals, for example - they suggest that you get no outside funding, and make your startup on the side (while working or going to school). They also suggest that location and distance is completely irrelevant in the internet age. If I remember correctly, worked on their initial products from across the world. Now, statistically speaking, YC companies probably has a higher success rate than the 37signals model, but your life is not a statistic. Focus on making something people want.
fleddermaus 19y ago
Whether you believe you can or whether you believe you can't, you are right. --attributed to Henry Ford. Entrepreneurs make it because they choose to, not because someone gives them the opportunity. The opportunity is always there, the question is whether or not you choose to make it happen. I've been reading "founders at work" and it surprises me that their opportunities were where they least expected it. So, cheer up and keep dreaming!
twelve88 19y ago
This is great advice. Going through the application is itself a great exercise in developing our products and pitches. There are so many paths to success, we just have to keep taking them as they come, whether they be in the form of organizations like Y-Combinator or serendipity... it's almost romantic, don't ya think?

49 points by jkush 19y ago

rkabir 19y ago

Before you hear back, you could do what we did - assume you got rejected. What would you do today if you knew you were rejected already? Hint: for bonus points, assume that YC is out to get you, and gives your brilliant idea[s] to some other shmucks. Strap down and build. Don't get bogged down in details.

DanielBMarkham 19y ago

Here's a bit of advice: be a startup junkie and not just a YC applicant. Startup junkies sill always follow startups: participating, sharing ideas, forming teams and making things happen. Being a startup junkie isn't something that is limited to any one funding cycle or organization. If you're a real junkie, YC is just a place to hang out while you're working on your own plans, which may have nothing to do with YC in the end. YC is just a tool which may or may not be available to you. If nothing else, you can monitor the board and listen while all kinds of cool stuff happens -- there's gold in being part of those conversations. Or as the old saying goes, "I've been kicked out of better places than this one"

jkush 19y ago
...and that too!

garbowza 19y ago

Just like many of us have succeeded regardless of which college we went to (or were rejected by), we can also succeed regardless of whether we're accepted by YC. Sure YC will help tremendously in some cases, but ultimately there is no single path to success. Reacting positively to whatever is thrown at you, under any circumstances will inevitably lead to success.

antirez 19y ago

> but you can still be very successful without YC Sure, but let's face it, to be "under YC" makes you much more able to hit success, all the other things being the same. This is not exactly fair, but it's how things work.

DanielBMarkham 19y ago
So does being Bill Gates' cousin, winning the SuperBowl, saving a kid from a burning building, having good parents, etc. Some of this stuff is random, some of this stuff you can make happen, and some is a combination. YC is a combination. They're doing their best to figure out who to pick and you're doing your best to make your company work. Golden rule of being self-employed: NEVER focus on one opportunity or plan. Always have several things going. And be flexible about it. What's PG say their success rate is? Something like 50%? Sure -- it'd be great to be in a graduating class, but getting into YC is NOT like passing a test. You don't control it and even for the people who do control it, it's a crap shoot. It's more like bumping into some folks in the hall and chatting a bit and giving them your business card. Maybe they'll call. Maybe not. Don't get your hopes on it. How much can you really convey to somebody by bumping into them and chatting in the hall?
- Alex3917 19y ago
  "How much can you really convey to somebody by bumping into them and chatting in the hall?" You can listen to what the other person has to say.
Zak 19y ago
The kind of people YC attempts to identify are the kind of people who will make it work with or without YC. If they're wrong about you, they'll regret it.
- rms 19y ago
  here's hoping

pg 19y ago

Another thing I'd ask people not to do is write to us asking for the details of why they weren't invited. We explain in the YC FAQ that we won't, but every cycle people deluge us with emails anyway. It's not because we're being secretive that we don't answer these emails. The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some glaring flaw in the application, but simply because nothing in it jumped out at us.

yarek 19y ago
This reminds me of the application process to Yale. To get int you've got to be really good -- top of your class, top of the district. But, that's not enough - lots of people of that caliber apply. You've got to have something about your application that makes you stand out, that makes you special. You will simply stick in the recruiter's mind. And in this case, stickiness is good. It's the same thing when you're creating a startup -- you got to stand out.
- nostrademons 19y ago
  Amherst does the same thing. However, Amherst's Dean of Admission then recites all the little factoids that stuck out at the regional receptions for admitted students. (This is always lampooned - hilariously - at the RC show, where upperclassmen put their own spin on it for incoming freshmen.) One of the factoids taken from my application was "One student took 8 AP tests, scoring 5s on 5 of them, without ever having taken an AP class." And I remember thinking, "What a dumb thing to fixate upon! My school didn't offer APs, so I couldn't take the courses. And the test was only $75 and could let me place out of several thousand dollars of college credit, so I'm not going to let something silly like not having taken the course stop me." My application had plenty of other impressive things on it, like starting a dot-com run exclusively by teenagers and watching it fail or placing tops in a couple of national math competitions. Yet what stuck out for them was the test scores. I guess the moral is to put down everything that might conceivably be impressive, because you never know what'll stick in the mind of the admissions person.
  - 19y ago

alaskamiller 19y ago

Well here's to my fourth attempt.

deleted 19y ago
[deleted]
edw519 19y ago
997 more and you'd be as persistent as Walt Disney. I bet you have an interesting story, alaskamiller. I imagine others here would like to hear it. Regardless of outcome this time, you should tell it here. I admire your tenacity. Good luck.

zandorg 19y ago

When I was rejected in November 2006, I sent a sarcastic (but not rude) email complaining about not being given a reason. However, I doubt anyone was offended. Anyway, I won't be doing that again.

andreyf 19y ago
I felt a little disappointed also, but Paul's point above makes sense: The reason is that there generally are no details to give. Usually when we don't invite a group for interviews, it's not because there was some glaring flaw in the application, but simply because nothing in it jumped out at us.
- adrianwaj 19y ago
  I would expect that in a more perfect world PG (or an equivalent) would also say "We also like to give feedback and point out the things that would have made us more interested had it been included."
  - andreyf 19y ago
    How about: "There was no glaring flaw in your application, but nothing in it jumped out at us. Next time, do something that will impress us more."
  - sbraford 19y ago
    The common refrain from VCs, book publishers -- anyone who gets large volumes of submissions and can only select a tiny minority is: * even attempting to respond (however briefly) to the deluge of requests would overwhelm us to the point that we could no longer focus on running the core business
    - adrianwaj 19y ago
      But, if all publishers gave feedback then the 'poor' authors would each save themselves from submitting to multiple publishers, and the 'poor' publishers deluged with submissions would instead have more refined manuscripts to evaluate and in lesser numbers. Thus, a little feedback can go a long way. This is because ideally manuscripts would improve only after a few submissions due to the feedback given and then they would either be accepted for publishing, referred to a more appropriate publisher, or shelved due to uninterested publishers.

andreyf 19y ago

As great as YC and Paul Graham's writings are, and as much as they are helping create a extraordinary startup community, there will always be many ways to success in a tech startup. Take 37signals, for example - they suggest that you get no outside funding, and make your startup on the side (while working or going to school). They also suggest that location and distance is completely irrelevant in the internet age. If I remember correctly, worked on their initial products from across the world. Now, statistically speaking, YC companies probably has a higher success rate than the 37signals model, but your life is not a statistic. Focus on making something people want.

fleddermaus 19y ago

Whether you believe you can or whether you believe you can't, you are right. --attributed to Henry Ford. Entrepreneurs make it because they choose to, not because someone gives them the opportunity. The opportunity is always there, the question is whether or not you choose to make it happen. I've been reading "founders at work" and it surprises me that their opportunities were where they least expected it. So, cheer up and keep dreaming!

twelve88 19y ago

This is great advice. Going through the application is itself a great exercise in developing our products and pitches. There are so many paths to success, we just have to keep taking them as they come, whether they be in the form of organizations like Y-Combinator or serendipity... it's almost romantic, don't ya think?