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> I’d say that self-discipline is at least as important as IQ for earning good report card grades. Or giving a shit. It's unfair to judge one's self-discipline
by erlanger 17y ago
> I’d say that self-discipline is at least as important as IQ for earning good report card grades.
Or giving a shit. It's unfair to judge one's self-discipline based on their performance in an activity they deem unproductive. People often hold compulsory education in the same esteem as at-will employment, analyzing it as though it were the student's "job," which is an error. Juvenile studies that fail to acknowledge this critical factor in the K-12 experience are useless when applying their findings to adults and general human behavior.
- prospero 17y agoThe article is discussing people who are good at ignoring short-term gratification in favor of long-term achievement. These people care about their future, so they have to give a shit about the present. That being said, I agree that the current educational system makes it pretty hard to have this attitude. I certainly didn't.
- nazgulnarsil 17y agoPeople often hold compulsory education in the same esteem as at-will employment, analyzing it as though it were the student's "job," agreed. education lags 25+ years behind the realities of being a productive member of society.
- gaius 17y agoOn another thread, I mentioned that there was a myth that all degrees are equally worthwhile, that the subject didn't matter because really you were "learning to learn". Now that's obviously complete nonsense, so where could it have come from? But that's obvious too: it comes from teachers, who themselves did some random artsy degree, then their teacher training, and having never had an industrial job, really believe it themselves. I'd like there to be a minimum age for teaching, say 50 or 60, so that we don't get kids (in the sense of experience of the real world) teaching kids. That'd neatly solve the ageism problem too, it would be normal to work in industry for 30-40 years, then go into teaching until you feel like retiring.
- DanielBMarkham 17y agoOver the past few years I have become convinced that some endeavors, like philosophy or teaching, really only work with older people. There's just too much frame-of-reference stuff that is required to do these well.
- scott_s 17y agoHiring teachers is a beggars-can't-be-choosers situation. Starting pay is relatively low, stress is high.
- gaius 17y agoJob security is very high, the pension scheme is very good, you get the summer off. There are much worse jobs than teaching.
- scott_s 17y agoThere certainly are. But not many people choose to go into it, and you're suggesting limiting that pool even more.
- tokenadult 17y agoThe number of people credentialed to be teachers in the United States is something close to double the number of people currently working as teachers. What's sad is that studies of teacher competency http://www.hoover.org/publications/digest/3506971.html http://www.hoover.org/publications/digest/3506971.html tend to show that the best teachers get squeezed out of the occupation the most rapidly, with lousier teachers hanging on to enjoy the job security and other nonsalary benefits. And probably at present the lack of attraction of (public sector) teaching to some job applicants results from the known low quality of many workers in that sector.
- billswift 17y agoStarting pay is pretty damn high for what they have to do and the teachers' general competence level.
- scott_s 17y agoEnd of that very same paragraph: My conviction, having taught for some years, is that what the American school system asks children to do is not groundbreaking intellectual work. One of the reasons self-discipline is so incredibly important is that almost anybody really can do the work if they want to, though, of course, not all children want to.
- erlanger 17y agoBriefly noting a vital detail is very different from factoring it into one's theories.