4 ms·

"The solution to the problem is, without a doubt, education," the adviser says. "Change won't happen until grown men start wanting to learn." That sums it up r

by pj 17y ago

"The solution to the problem is, without a doubt, education," the adviser says. "Change won't happen until grown men start wanting to learn." That sums it up right there and by "it," I mean "all of it." The problem. The problem with our society. The problem with the educational system. The problem with our national debt. With our dependence on foreign oil. Why don't people want to learn anymore? I don't understand why it seems so easy, so obvious, that "this" just isn't the way. Am I the only one frustrated by the continued bad decision making? We sell these poor athletes, and I mean poor in every sense, the illusion of wealth and fame and happiness and then rip the carpet right out from under them. It takes years, decades of dedication to a dream and then they are bankrupt. Not only do they not have the millions they were "promised," but they have no education, no skills applicable outside sports, their bodies are too old to do the only thing they can do. Why do we keep doing this to people? It's really sad. It makes me really sad. What's going to happen? I can't see anything good coming from this. I can't see any good future down this path. It feels so much like the wrong path. I feel like I'm being taken down this bad path against my will. I don't want to go down this path, but it's like I'm stuck in this huge pack of people all stampeding toward a huge cliff and I don't want to run over the cliff. "There's a cliff ahead!!" I yell and no one hears it, they're too busy running, not even knowing where they are going. What am I supposed to do? What are people who don't want to go off the cliff supposed to do?

DanielBMarkham 17y ago
Start a parachute company
- pj 17y ago
  clever, thanks for that. I need a laugh in this state of mind. :)
  - DanielBMarkham 17y ago
    There are always options. There are always solutions. Sometimes we're not the ones who come up with them, and sometimes we just suffer while somebody else is busy solving problems, but that's life. I look at it like this: taken at an individual level, each person is a precious gift: unique, special, etc. Taken as a group level, as a generic, people are really stupid. Over and over again I've seen really smart people do really dumb things. It's amazing. So when a bunch of PhDs or other smart people do idiotic things, it's not surprising that some hoop-shooter or pigskin jockey would be the same way. We're all stupid, just in different ways. : ) Somehow the race keeps on solving problems anyway.
  - evilneanderthal 17y ago
    In all seriousness, w/rt your state of mind. Going by this rant and the one in the other thread. You keep talking about herd mentality - "our" society, "this huge pack of people" etc. Who are these people? I don't particularly feel like you and I are associated in any way. "We" aren't doing anything to anybody. If you feel like you are contributing to an unethical enterprise, and you don't feel good about that, then stop doing it. Likewise, if you feel like you aren't producing value and doing the hard work and learning anymore, then this is a problem that you must fix. I'm over here producing value and doing hard work and learning. I can't speak as to whether what you're doing is worth anything - that's your problem.
    - pj 17y ago
      These people are us. They include me, you, America, the world. It's not just my problem, because what I do, what you do, what everyone does affects everyone else. I can produce tons of value and our society can still crumble because of greed and mistakes (and I too make lots of mistakes) made by other people. The question, more generally, is how do we change society's definition of value. How do we convince the world to spend more on teachers than it spends on athletes? Did you know in ancient Greece, philosophers were exempt from taxation because they were so valued by society? In the past, thought was valued above all. We need to go back there and revive thinking as a valued contribution to society.
      - evilneanderthal 17y ago
        Society's definition of value - there is no such thing. If something is valuable to you, then you can pay for it. There's no secret magic underlying economics. When the supply of people willing to teach is lower than the number of available teaching positions, the value of a teacher rises. Editted - forgot I wasn't on /irc/ =]
edw519 17y ago
"Why don't people want to learn anymore?" Most of these athletes never did. They are the opposite of us. While we were misunderstood for all those years working our butts off in anonymity, they were getting their butts kissed. From the time they were toddlers. All the way through school where they were promoted along whether or not they ever went to class. When you have nothing left for the ass kissers to kiss, then what are you going to do?
- wallflower 17y ago
  I was shocked the other day to read that basically really good athletes at a top-tier sports schools are basically professional athletes. Boosters lease SUVs like Cadillac Escalades, give the athletes the keys to the car - and it's all quasi-legal because the Boosters aren't technically directly affiliated with the athletic program. When in the States there is so much societal pressure to be athletic/look athletic/enjoy the spectacle of sports, I think we are in trouble where Asian tigers like China have societal pressure and strong peer approval to study hard and aspire to become engineers.
  - erlanger 17y ago
    When in the States there is so much societal pressure to be athletic/look athletic/enjoy the spectacle of sports, I think we are in trouble where Asian tigers like China have societal pressure and strong peer approval to study hard and aspire to become engineers. The strongest push in the US (and it's not even close) is to make money. The intense materialism here will insulate the country from most of its truly dangerous fools simply because capitalism works so well. Tocqueville, back in the early 19th century, made a note of the anti-intellectual streak in the US and said that a scholar would generally be happier in Europe unless they could occupy themselves with the challenge of earning dough. Times have not changed. Except for a burst of scientific enthusiasm at the peak of the Cold War (1946-1964), commerce has driven most innovation.
  - biohacker42 17y ago
    Sports programs in US schools are quite remarkable. They clearly bring in a lot of revenue for the schools and it seems to me that's a good thing. The bad thing is everything having to do with the student athletes. So why not just make college sports professional. Just like the NFL and the NBA, this would simply be another league, made up of college branded teams. Ah, but we can't do that, we can't call a spade a spade. Society has to maintain a charade. It's like collectively we're in the closet. And we're very passionate about college sports but we just can not get out of the closet and say fuck it, just make the sports program professional.

by pj 17y ago

DanielBMarkham 17y ago

Start a parachute company

pj 17y ago
clever, thanks for that. I need a laugh in this state of mind. :)
- DanielBMarkham 17y ago
  There are always options. There are always solutions. Sometimes we're not the ones who come up with them, and sometimes we just suffer while somebody else is busy solving problems, but that's life. I look at it like this: taken at an individual level, each person is a precious gift: unique, special, etc. Taken as a group level, as a generic, people are really stupid. Over and over again I've seen really smart people do really dumb things. It's amazing. So when a bunch of PhDs or other smart people do idiotic things, it's not surprising that some hoop-shooter or pigskin jockey would be the same way. We're all stupid, just in different ways. : ) Somehow the race keeps on solving problems anyway.
- evilneanderthal 17y ago
  In all seriousness, w/rt your state of mind. Going by this rant and the one in the other thread. You keep talking about herd mentality - "our" society, "this huge pack of people" etc. Who are these people? I don't particularly feel like you and I are associated in any way. "We" aren't doing anything to anybody. If you feel like you are contributing to an unethical enterprise, and you don't feel good about that, then stop doing it. Likewise, if you feel like you aren't producing value and doing the hard work and learning anymore, then this is a problem that you must fix. I'm over here producing value and doing hard work and learning. I can't speak as to whether what you're doing is worth anything - that's your problem.
  - pj 17y ago
    These people are us. They include me, you, America, the world. It's not just my problem, because what I do, what you do, what everyone does affects everyone else. I can produce tons of value and our society can still crumble because of greed and mistakes (and I too make lots of mistakes) made by other people. The question, more generally, is how do we change society's definition of value. How do we convince the world to spend more on teachers than it spends on athletes? Did you know in ancient Greece, philosophers were exempt from taxation because they were so valued by society? In the past, thought was valued above all. We need to go back there and revive thinking as a valued contribution to society.
    - evilneanderthal 17y ago
      Society's definition of value - there is no such thing. If something is valuable to you, then you can pay for it. There's no secret magic underlying economics. When the supply of people willing to teach is lower than the number of available teaching positions, the value of a teacher rises. Editted - forgot I wasn't on /irc/ =]

edw519 17y ago

"Why don't people want to learn anymore?" Most of these athletes never did. They are the opposite of us. While we were misunderstood for all those years working our butts off in anonymity, they were getting their butts kissed. From the time they were toddlers. All the way through school where they were promoted along whether or not they ever went to class. When you have nothing left for the ass kissers to kiss, then what are you going to do?

wallflower 17y ago
I was shocked the other day to read that basically really good athletes at a top-tier sports schools are basically professional athletes. Boosters lease SUVs like Cadillac Escalades, give the athletes the keys to the car - and it's all quasi-legal because the Boosters aren't technically directly affiliated with the athletic program. When in the States there is so much societal pressure to be athletic/look athletic/enjoy the spectacle of sports, I think we are in trouble where Asian tigers like China have societal pressure and strong peer approval to study hard and aspire to become engineers.
- erlanger 17y ago
  When in the States there is so much societal pressure to be athletic/look athletic/enjoy the spectacle of sports, I think we are in trouble where Asian tigers like China have societal pressure and strong peer approval to study hard and aspire to become engineers. The strongest push in the US (and it's not even close) is to make money. The intense materialism here will insulate the country from most of its truly dangerous fools simply because capitalism works so well. Tocqueville, back in the early 19th century, made a note of the anti-intellectual streak in the US and said that a scholar would generally be happier in Europe unless they could occupy themselves with the challenge of earning dough. Times have not changed. Except for a burst of scientific enthusiasm at the peak of the Cold War (1946-1964), commerce has driven most innovation.
- biohacker42 17y ago
  Sports programs in US schools are quite remarkable. They clearly bring in a lot of revenue for the schools and it seems to me that's a good thing. The bad thing is everything having to do with the student athletes. So why not just make college sports professional. Just like the NFL and the NBA, this would simply be another league, made up of college branded teams. Ah, but we can't do that, we can't call a spade a spade. Society has to maintain a charade. It's like collectively we're in the closet. And we're very passionate about college sports but we just can not get out of the closet and say fuck it, just make the sports program professional.