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Walgreens says about the nasal spray "It should not be used in pregnant women" which implies it is harmful in some way, does it not? http://www.walgreens.com/m

by yapcguy 13y ago

Walgreens says about the nasal spray "It should not be used in pregnant women" which implies it is harmful in some way, does it not? http://www.walgreens.com/marketing/library/contents.jsp?docid=002025&doctype=1 http://www.walgreens.com/marketing/library/contents.jsp?doci... Flu shot by injection does contain thimerosal, unless you get the special version which doesn't. Walgreens and Safeway have a limited supply of it and people have to call ahead to get this special version. Given that an OB confirmed the above to me and I watched the OB's nurse administer a single shot without thimerosal, I think I'm more right than you on these matters.

ceejayoz 13y ago
> Walgreens says about the nasal spray "It should not be used in pregnant women" which implies it is harmful in some way, does it not? Not at all. Sometimes medicines are contraindicated simply because there isn't enough study in the population at question. If the flu shot is known to be safe and the nasal, while believed to be safe, still needs more study in pregnant women, they'll recommend the shot. > Flu shot by injection does contain thimerosal, unless you get the special version which doesn't. Some of it does, some of it doesn't. It's a red herring - the safety of thimerosal is long since stablished, attempts from fraudsters like Wakefield notwithstanding. > Given that an OB confirmed the above to me Many OBs will spout the American theory that a single glass of red wine is bad for a baby, too. I'll trust the CDC over anecdotes from individual OBs.
mikeash 13y ago
The nasal spray is contraindicated for anyone with a weakened immune system because it's an attenuated virus vaccine. That doesn't mean that it's dangerous for the rest of us.
- yapcguy 13y ago
  And just how do "the rest of us" know if we have a weakened immune system? If the objective is to do good and save lives, why not give everybody the same "safer" flu shot as given to pregnant women? Why not eliminate the risk that a few people wander into Walgreens, not knowing they have a weakened immune system, and then get seriously ill or worse, drop dead?
  - ceejayoz 13y ago
    > And just how do "the rest of us" know if we have a weakened immune system? You generally know if you're undergoing chemo, have AIDS, are pregnant, are over 50, etc. The provider administering will jog your memory, too. > If the objective is to do good and save lives, why not give everybody the same "safer" flu shot as given to pregnant women? According to Wikipedia, there's evidence it's more effective in young children. As with most medical treatments, there are risks and benefits that must be considered. The fact that it doesn't require a needle also has significant benefits, as fear of needles can be a barrier to vaccination. By all means, continue the argument from ignorance and personal incredulity, though.
    - yapcguy 13y ago
      I never said don't take vaccines. Yes, I do find it quite incredible that questioning the efficacy of vaccines is like a red flag to a bull for some people. Even though the Lancet has published research examining the flu vaccine's effectiveness, it appears any kind of discussion is strictly forbidden. I don't want to use the word "fascist" but this discussion has clearly shown that the people who are truly ignorant are those who fail to consider dissenting viewpoints.
      - mikeash 13y ago
        What's a red flag is not questioning the efficacy of vaccines, but rather doing so in an ignorant and incredulous manner without doing any research.
      - ceejayoz 13y ago
        > I don't want to use the word "fascist" but this discussion has clearly shown that the people who are truly ignorant are those who fail to consider dissenting viewpoints. I have little patience for the "explain this... oh... well, explain THIS! oh... well..." game vaccine doubters play.
        mikeash 13y ago
        It's pretty incredible. "If this gravity stuff worked like you said, then cars would all be stuck to the ground." "Well actually, they are." "Sure, usually, but I saw a picture of a car that landed on top of another car. Clearly there are some flaws in this gravity thing." "It's true that there are ways to get cars off the ground, but they don't stay off the ground for long, and their behavior still fits entirely within the theory of gravity. This is pretty basic stuff and you should really research it." And then they call you a "fascist" for "not tolerating dissenting views".

by yapcguy 13y ago

ceejayoz 13y ago

> Walgreens says about the nasal spray "It should not be used in pregnant women" which implies it is harmful in some way, does it not? Not at all. Sometimes medicines are contraindicated simply because there isn't enough study in the population at question. If the flu shot is known to be safe and the nasal, while believed to be safe, still needs more study in pregnant women, they'll recommend the shot. > Flu shot by injection does contain thimerosal, unless you get the special version which doesn't. Some of it does, some of it doesn't. It's a red herring - the safety of thimerosal is long since stablished, attempts from fraudsters like Wakefield notwithstanding. > Given that an OB confirmed the above to me Many OBs will spout the American theory that a single glass of red wine is bad for a baby, too. I'll trust the CDC over anecdotes from individual OBs.

mikeash 13y ago

The nasal spray is contraindicated for anyone with a weakened immune system because it's an attenuated virus vaccine. That doesn't mean that it's dangerous for the rest of us.

yapcguy 13y ago
And just how do "the rest of us" know if we have a weakened immune system? If the objective is to do good and save lives, why not give everybody the same "safer" flu shot as given to pregnant women? Why not eliminate the risk that a few people wander into Walgreens, not knowing they have a weakened immune system, and then get seriously ill or worse, drop dead?
- ceejayoz 13y ago
  > And just how do "the rest of us" know if we have a weakened immune system? You generally know if you're undergoing chemo, have AIDS, are pregnant, are over 50, etc. The provider administering will jog your memory, too. > If the objective is to do good and save lives, why not give everybody the same "safer" flu shot as given to pregnant women? According to Wikipedia, there's evidence it's more effective in young children. As with most medical treatments, there are risks and benefits that must be considered. The fact that it doesn't require a needle also has significant benefits, as fear of needles can be a barrier to vaccination. By all means, continue the argument from ignorance and personal incredulity, though.
  - yapcguy 13y ago
    I never said don't take vaccines. Yes, I do find it quite incredible that questioning the efficacy of vaccines is like a red flag to a bull for some people. Even though the Lancet has published research examining the flu vaccine's effectiveness, it appears any kind of discussion is strictly forbidden. I don't want to use the word "fascist" but this discussion has clearly shown that the people who are truly ignorant are those who fail to consider dissenting viewpoints.
    - mikeash 13y ago
      What's a red flag is not questioning the efficacy of vaccines, but rather doing so in an ignorant and incredulous manner without doing any research.
    - ceejayoz 13y ago
      > I don't want to use the word "fascist" but this discussion has clearly shown that the people who are truly ignorant are those who fail to consider dissenting viewpoints. I have little patience for the "explain this... oh... well, explain THIS! oh... well..." game vaccine doubters play.
      - mikeash 13y ago
        It's pretty incredible. "If this gravity stuff worked like you said, then cars would all be stuck to the ground." "Well actually, they are." "Sure, usually, but I saw a picture of a car that landed on top of another car. Clearly there are some flaws in this gravity thing." "It's true that there are ways to get cars off the ground, but they don't stay off the ground for long, and their behavior still fits entirely within the theory of gravity. This is pretty basic stuff and you should really research it." And then they call you a "fascist" for "not tolerating dissenting views".