14 ms·

CyanogenMod Installer Application Removed from Play Store

290 points by eknkc 13y ago

JPKab 13y ago
Good old Googlesoft.
- josh2600 13y ago
  Embrace, Extend, Extinguish.
  - hahainternet 13y ago
    It's a nice attempt at being pithy but in this case it's more Open, Embrace, Moderate.
fidotron 13y ago
At this point it really looks like Google have zero interest in seeing Android improve, beyond ensuring it stays superficially in line with iOS or Windows Phone, and will use whatever means necessary to ensure no one else does it while desperately trying to shoe horn irrelevant features into Chrome in an effort to reach feature parity. The clause about no forking with the SDK is probably going to rear its head in anger soon.
- asdfaoeu 13y ago
  This is complete bullshit, they've improved the runtime and performance in the most recent version among other things. It's not at all surprising that this application was removed would you expect to see an install Ubuntu application in the Mac or Windows app stores?
  - omegote 13y ago
    The most recent version... that I cannot install in my Galaxy Nexus, which is barely two years old. I've been an Apple hater all my life, but this, Google, this is epic bullshit.
    - coldtea 13y ago
      >I've been an Apple hater all my life Isn't that a sad thing to be? And for most people mostly stemming out of reverse hipsterism, nonetheless...
      - reginaldjcooper 13y ago
        That's not a sad thing to be, at least recently. Apple is one of the major enemies of personal computing freedom.
        coldtea 13y ago
        I don't know, I seen to have a free compiler on my Apple laptop. And a handheld mobile OS with unprecedented capabilities people would be dreaming of just a decade ago -- that I can code for by spending like $100, including the ability to release my apps to half a billion with credit cards at the ready. Perhaps if you're young enough to only remember the "everything must be FOSS" times, and not the times we paid $100-$300 for a proprietary compiler this seems very restrictive.
        reginaldjcooper 13y ago
        I guess you can download the LLVM source but that has nothing to do with Apple. > that I can code for by spending like $100 Odd that you think that's freedom, because I can put my own apps on my own phone for actual free. I can put other people's apps on my own phone without signing up for an app store and without a third party's permission. I can send my apps to anyone I want and charge them via my own payment processor if I want. I agree we now have a "handheld mobile OS with unprecedented capabilities" and that iOS and the App Store were incredibly innovative a few years ago. But the problem is not whether or not I am allowed to develop an app, the problem is whether or not I am allowed to use my device on my terms. I couldn't even add a caller blacklist on iOS. Also let's say I without any argument accept the idea that the past was less free. That still doesn't make what Apple are doing now free in any shape or form, that's just a flat-out logical fallacy. If you have to appeal to a worse past to explain how you are relatively free you have basically conceded the argument.
  - BorisMelnik 13y ago
    no, but I wouldn't be surprised if I saw intall Windows or Mac app inside of a Ubuntu store :)
  - anonymfus 13y ago
    Wubi still does not support UEFI/GPT systems, but it would be very interesting thing to check.
  - fidotron 13y ago
    It's not bullshit at all. The bulk of what development they're doing is now not in AOSP, but things like the Hangouts app or Play Services. The other changes are increasingly minor while stability on their own Nexus devices has gone down. For example, were you to improve the Android stock messaging app they are completely within their rights to prevent you pushing it back into AOSP, and worse, if you make a breaking change and distribute as an "improved Android" you could be classed as a fork, which violates the T&C of the SDK. Google having this veto to artificially hold back Android prevents other players from producing interesting forks of it. Cyanogenmod will be perceived as a long term threat, and so they will progressively up the stakes in order to make life difficult, but they're starting with stuff which is easier to justify. Once they've started the fanboys will find it much harder to change their tune. You can see what's been going on by their staff situation.
    - BitMastro 13y ago
      I don't think so, there's a lot of development in AOSP as well, Hangouts and Play Services are only getting major visibility because they can be deployed to all versions of Android without waiting for the manufacturers. On the other end, I think that forks with breaking changes could lead to fragmentation, where some stuff works in a fork and doesn't in the other. Isn't that the definition of breaking change?
- nexx 13y ago
  Made an account just to remind you that Cyanogenmod installer brickled many phones. It's totally normal for them to remove it.
  - enraged_camel 13y ago
    Yep. They do not want the fact that a major weakness of Android as a platform (openness = the ability to fuck up your phone) is being highlighted.
    - pwnna 13y ago
      Wait. I thought the ability to fuck up your phone (also known as replacing the shitty UI/crapware that your manufacture forced on you) is a major strength of Android phones?
      - shocks 13y ago
        I get it, you're both joking about how these 'flaws' allow us to do cool things with our phones - but the point being made (which you're both missing or ignoring) is that not everyone is tech-savvy like us and it's very possible for them to brick their devices.
        pwnna 13y ago
        It is a double edge sword. I think this is too early to tell, wait to see if Google will reinstate the app after big warnings in the description.
- byjove 13y ago
  Did you actually read beyond the headline?! Google didn't remove the app they contacted CyanogenMod about the app being in violation of TOS because it ‘encourages users to void their warranty’ (a totally valid reason) so they voluntarily removed it to sort things out, probably will need to add a disclaimer or something. I'm not quite sure what you find so objectionable, or how relevant is you comment here.
  - andyroid 13y ago
    Did you actually read beyond the headline? "They advised us to voluntarily remove the application, or they would be forced to remove it administratively." Which is like saying "He wasn't fired, he was just forced to resign".
    - byjove 13y ago
      You're missing the point, the app is in violation of the TOS, the fact that Google is in contact with the CyanogenMod team about the issues means that it's just an adjustment that is required for it to comply. There have been reports about people bricking their deviced with the app, requiring a proper warning would not be out of line.
      - andyroid 13y ago
        Yes, and that's because your point is made up. The article makes no mention of them being asked to remove it while sorting things out or "add a disclaimer or something". While it's possible that's actually what happened, it's certainly not mentioned in the article. That's just speculation on your part - which I only called out as you accused fidotron of not reading beyond the headline.
    - devindotcom 13y ago
      It's more like leaving when you're asked to instead of being kicked out by the bouncer. It seems pretty clear that it violates the TOS, but I'm sure they'll find another way in.
interpol_p 13y ago
While I view this move as hypocritical of Google, it does feel like it's in their customers' best interest. Think about it from a less technical perspective: I can install an app from the official Google Play store that voids my warranty. They can't have that on their public facing store. Google wants users to install apps, they don't want them to be afraid of voiding their warranty. It's interesting to see how things played out over the last few years. Google has been moving towards a more controlled environment, from something that was initially billed as open. Apple started completely locked down with a strong customer focus, and has cautiously been making their policies more developer friendly. I personally prefer Apple's approach, as it was always about the end user — but as a developer I was sometimes envious of Google's lenient policy. Google's assertion of control now makes me more interested in developing for their platform.
- MichaelGG 13y ago
  The app doesn't void your warranty. It encourages you to perform further actions that may void your warranty. Major difference. The article is clear that Google admits the app itself is not harmful.
  - interpol_p 13y ago
    I don't think that's a good enough distinction. If it's from the official store it should not even indirectly lead to harming your device or warranty. If an app tells you to throw your phone in the air — and I was both the phone hardware manufacturer and app store curator — I wouldn't allow it on my store either. It's going to increase customer complaints.
    - eieio 13y ago
      Not sure if you're intentionally referencing this, but there are definitely apps in the Google Play store that explicitly encourage you to throw your phone in the air, such as Send Me To Heaven app[1] [1] https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.carrotpop.www.smth&hl=en https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.carrotpop.... (I don't actually disagree with your point, just thought it was funny)
g8oz 13y ago
It seems like no matter how blatantly Google carries out it's updated "Microsoft from the 1990's" act there will be a coterie of apologists on HN explaining away it's actions. The Cold War provided an appropriate label for this crowd: "useful idiots".
- devindotcom 13y ago
  This was a TOS violation, nothing 90s-Microsoft about it.
  - zhuzhuor 13y ago
    quoted from the article: After reaching out to the Play team, their feedback was that though application itself is harmless, and not actually in violation of their Terms of Service,...
    - patrickaljord 13y ago
      They updated the article, the app is in violation of the TOS. > Update: Removed reference to stating the app was not in violation of TOS – this was a mischaracterization of Google’s statement.
  - colechristensen 13y ago
    Having a rule in the TOS doesn't make it right. And you are right, it's not 90s-Microsoft, it's worse. I'd say it's reasonable to believe that vast majority of average users _never_ acquire software outside of the walled gardens of Mirosoft, Google, and Apple's app stores. There sure are benefits to these walled gardens, but the loss of freedom to corporate whim should be a very serious concern to everyone here.
    - thezilch 13y ago
      What freedoms were lost, exactly?
      - 13y ago
mirsadm 13y ago
I think this is completely reasonable. If people want to sideload the app then by all means go for it. The Play Store shouldn't allow apps that can potentially damage your device (or void your warranty).
- ajross 13y ago
  It's reasonable and not. The installer is a tool for assisted rooting. Yes, that's dangerous and voids warranties. But just search for "root" on the Play Store and you'll find thousands of apps designed to exploit and utilize that status. These are great features, and Google clearly allows them... That said, part of me is chuckling internally that CM got caught being unable to distribute their proprietary (windows-only!) "installer" solution through Google's proprietary distribution channel. There are open source paths to a solution here, and CM didn't even try...
  - notatoad 13y ago
    An application that only runs if your warranty is already voided, and an application that actually voids your warranty are two very different things. You've got to remember google's position here - for the majority of phones sold, they aren't the manufacturer or the warranty provider. If they allow cyanogen in the play store and it creates a huge warranty headache for Samsung or Sony or any other OEM that includes the play store by default, it jeopardizes google's ability to distribute the Play Store.
joeblau 13y ago
When Google is saying CyanogenMod is voiding warranties, are they talking about warranties from the hardware manufacturers? It feels like the OS is open, but the Hardware is not.
- cdash 13y ago
  Yes. So have fun spending 800 dollars to replace your phone when it is bricked, but as expected many here instantly jumped on the google hate train.
naner 13y ago
With the CM Installer in the play store many lay-people started using it, rendering their phones unusable[1] when any little issue cropped up. Also the process wasn't foolproof even for people capable of dealing with technical issues[2]. It isn't polished enough to go in the play store IMO. I don't know WTF the cyanogenmod team was thinking, non-technical people messing with CM will just lead to negative press. 1: http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/comments/1qkfaw/cannot_uninstall_cm_version_from_the_play_store/ http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/comments/1qkfaw/cannot_uninst... 2: http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/comments/1qi5lw/official_cyanogenmod_installer_released_our_phone/cdd8bfg http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/comments/1qi5lw/official_cyan...
- iamshs 13y ago
  But that is only one person whose phone is rendered unusable and not many as you insinuate. Same thing happened with PS4 launch when people reported issues, but statistic turned out to be <1%. This app is exactly for the non-technical people to stop messing around. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/11/android-roms-the-easy-way-testing-the-new-cyanogenmod-installer/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/11/android-roms-the-easy...
  - thezilch 13y ago
    The same thing did not happen with the PS4 launch; there, the consumer can get a FREE replacement of the damaged goods. Here, you're SOL. The best I can tell, this is like all of those teenagers installing Napster, Kazaa, or whatever on grandma's PC. Feds show up and "OMG, fines!? I didn't know! I'm computer dumb. I paid $10/month for all nsync!" I love what CM is doing, but if lay persons and even "experts" are getting burnt, who is responsible? Who gets blamed? Google? Because that's the first place consumers are going to go or to distributors or manufacturers who are going to also going to defer to Google.
  - byjove 13y ago
    Browse the support forums of carries and device makers and you'll find plenty of such testimonials. They would brick their devices and find themselves without warranty, which is not exactly an ideal situation.
Mikeb85 13y ago
Understandable. If people don't know how to enable developer mode, Adb debugging, sideload apps, etc..., they shouldn't be messing around with modding their phone. It really doesn't belong in the Play store.
imahboob 13y ago
Well there are other ways in which you can crack an android phone, cyanogen was just a noob friendly way to do so...
davidp 13y ago
If Google knowingly allowed their app store to host software that harms carrier-supported devices, they might easily be in breach of contract with those carriers. This is a defensive move.
oddshocks 13y ago
Windows only? Are you joking around?
Zigurd 13y ago
This is less a matter of Google being evil or hypocritical. Google is just being dumb. CyanogenMod is an important part of the Android ecosystem, and should be an even more important part of that ecosystem. Google should encourage aftermarket Android distributions. They serve the customers who want a truly open source Android and they serve the orphaned devices users. It you RTFA, you see that the app has a very simple function and mostly serves to enable discovery of CyanogenMod. The actual installation requires a Windows PC.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
pilooch 13y ago
put it on fdroid
DanBC 13y ago
Customers buy a phone. That phone is loaded with terrible, awful, software and unpleasant branding. Customers want to remove that software and that branding. One way is to use scary software like Cyanogenmod. There is not other way. Maybe Google and customers need to start pressuring carriers to stop loading phones with this awful software?
- thezilch 13y ago
  Maybe customers should stop buying awful software? There are plenty of offerings, including Google's own phone. What more can Google do? Close off Android to crapware providers and they'll have the wrath of the community donning their pitchforks. This thread alone should be an example of how irrational some folks are, crying fowl at Google for not wanting brickware in their store.
  - Macha 13y ago
    Selling their own phone in more countries would be a good start. Even in the countries where they do sell the phone, they often only sell it via their web store, so user's who don't research phones beyond walking into a phone shop don't know it exists.
icefox 13y ago
I like how http://www.cyanogenmod.org/ http://www.cyanogenmod.org/ doesn't really tell you what it is or why I would want it.
- smtddr 13y ago
  http://i.imgur.com/EEmBXsq.png http://i.imgur.com/EEmBXsq.png
  - icefox 13y ago
    Documentation is for if I already want it, not for figuring out what the thing is. And if you follow the link to http://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/CyanogenMod_Installer http://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/CyanogenMod_Installer you still don't find any reason to use it (whatever "it" is) This question is the closest, lets hope people click on it too: >Why flash CyanogenMod? >There are many reasons to consider for flashing your device. Check out our Why Mod? page for more info! http://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/Why_Mod%3F http://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/Why_Mod%3F Then goes on to talk about moding (I guess CyanogenMod is a "mod", but it doesn't explicitly say so right off the bat) and goes on to talk about the cons and pros of modding, but doesn't actually tell you why I would want CyanogenMod until I scroll more than a page down to a bunch of similar screenshots. So three links deep hidden in the bottom half of a wiki page is a (even complete?) feature set of CyanogenMod. Again cyanogenmod flat out fails to tell new users what they do and why I might want it on the main page. I wonder what the bounce rate on the main page is.
shmerl 13y ago
Google is a new Apple?
eDavis698 13y ago
The new CM installer nearly bricked my phone! This would be a warrenty/customer support nightmare for Verizon/ATT/Samsung/HTC/whoever. Preface: I consider myself a fairly advanced power user on linux as a hobby, and I'm a computer technician/sysadmin [Windows] by day. I've had two Android phones over the past two years. I have a Verizon Galaxy Nexus and was pissed that Verizon decided that phone was not to get 4.3 let alone Google decided no 4.4 for the Galaxy Nexus...(Each iteration of Android broke more things like speech to text.) Rather than wait for the never coming updates I started studying how to flash Cyanogenmod onto this. It looked a bit convoluted even compared to flashing firmware onto micro-contollers. Then the app hit the Play store and I figured I would give it a shot. The app showed you what settings needed changed (like enable USB debugging) and how to do them, even to the point of opening the settings screens for you. A casual user would never even be able to find the settings again after that first opening. It would be akin to going straight to the Computer Management console in Windows or loading up fstab in Linux without telling a casual end user how to get there! My install process did not go smooth. The first thing it had wrong was the connection mode, said to use Camera Mode PTP instead of MTP. That is flat out wrong for this phone and it won't connect. Then during the bootloader/rooting process, which the installer fully automatically does for you(!) a critical USB driver failed to install and it locked the phone up. The soft power button does not respond here and luckily I was able to pull the battery to reset. If this was a Nexus 4 or 5...I would have been praying that once the battery died I could still power it up for a recharge; a very good possibility it would have been bricked. Now that the software is installed I have no Photosphere in the camera and I can no longer connect to my work exchange calendar. I also managed to lose a few stored contacts somehow. I knew to backup my pictures/docs/data but a typical user would not. Now imagine a typical consumer has just purchased a Galaxy S4 on contract for $199. They flash CM onto it and now best case they call Verizon/ATT/Samsung wanting to know why feature X isn't working or why they lost the phone numbers of their friends/family – or worse their baby pictures/movies. Now that company either says 'Go fly a kite' or reflashes and they still have data loss. If the phone bricks they will be shocked to learn they will need to pony up $650 to replace it replace it!
mushroomhead 13y ago
Unlike appstore where most accounts is password protected on download because of credit card associated with their account. Most android phone user don't set such restriction, and what truth is most kids just download whatever they saw on playstore. Google did the right thing to remove a dangerous app with potential to break your device.
37prime 13y ago
I have just download CyanogenMod Installer from Google Play Store and still have it in my now Android KitKat-running Nexus 4. I intended to install CyanogenMod 10.1.3 which is based on Android Jelly Bean 4.2.2, on my nexus 4. I have not done so. --- I also have the intention to install the stock Android Jelly Bean 4.3 on the same nexus 4; downgrading from Android KitKat 4.4. I found that Android KitKat on Nexus 4 (and Nexus 5) now redirect tethering network traffic to the carrier login page, specifically T-Mobile USA. Strangely, I had no problems using the built-in tethering (Nexus 4 - Andorid KitKat combo) with AT&T network.
- conradfr 13y ago
  This can be disabled, just google it.
  - 37prime 13y ago
    I know how to do that and it generally requires roting the device or buying an app. It really bothers me to find out that Google is taking away a feature specifically to appease T-Mobile. Pure Android experience no more.
sushirain 13y ago
A better compromise would have been to just enforce a modal warning message in the play store, such as: "Warning! This app can brick your device. Google is not responsible for its damages, and you may loose other warranties, too!" Regarding kids, that would overlook the warning, they still have to download the PC software. So the procedure isn't significantly more simplified than going directly to the website.
Create 13y ago
Fortunately, Android is open enough Well, make CyanogenMod Installer Application open enough and put it onto F-droid. Don't wan't to? Well, neither GOOG ...so much about openness PR.
IgorPartola 13y ago
This entire fiasco with the Android ecosystem stems from locked down bootloaders. How many people have bricked their PC's by installing a different OS on them? Why can we not have the same model for phones: If you brick it, some tiny bit of ROM can be invoked which connects to the Internet, downloads, verifies, and installs the latest carrier approved OS. This simple fail safe means that it is impossible to brick a phone and I bet instructions for how to initiate this reset could be made very simple. Instead, it seems that the OS and the bootloader are tightly coupled and the OS can actually screw up the bootloader, which is the root of all Android evil.
babesh 13y ago
Android isn't open. It's Google's and they want to keep it this way. iOS isn't open. It's Apple's and they want to keep it that way. The open spiel was pure marketing to gain market share. Now that they have it, they are locking things down to maintain control. Threatening decertification, requiring google play services, certification by a private party,... Now that the open argument no longer works, people are defending it as pro consumer. Hogwash. Edit: http://techcrunch.com/2013/09/18/cyanogen-mod-7m-benchmark/ http://techcrunch.com/2013/09/18/cyanogen-mod-7m-benchmark/ Cyanogen has basically become a competitor to Google
derleth 13y ago
As long as CM phones home, it shouldn't be in the Play Store.

290 points by eknkc 13y ago

JPKab 13y ago

Good old Googlesoft.

josh2600 13y ago
Embrace, Extend, Extinguish.
- hahainternet 13y ago
  It's a nice attempt at being pithy but in this case it's more Open, Embrace, Moderate.

fidotron 13y ago

At this point it really looks like Google have zero interest in seeing Android improve, beyond ensuring it stays superficially in line with iOS or Windows Phone, and will use whatever means necessary to ensure no one else does it while desperately trying to shoe horn irrelevant features into Chrome in an effort to reach feature parity. The clause about no forking with the SDK is probably going to rear its head in anger soon.

asdfaoeu 13y ago
This is complete bullshit, they've improved the runtime and performance in the most recent version among other things. It's not at all surprising that this application was removed would you expect to see an install Ubuntu application in the Mac or Windows app stores?
- omegote 13y ago
  The most recent version... that I cannot install in my Galaxy Nexus, which is barely two years old. I've been an Apple hater all my life, but this, Google, this is epic bullshit.
  - coldtea 13y ago
    >I've been an Apple hater all my life Isn't that a sad thing to be? And for most people mostly stemming out of reverse hipsterism, nonetheless...
    - reginaldjcooper 13y ago
      That's not a sad thing to be, at least recently. Apple is one of the major enemies of personal computing freedom.
      - coldtea 13y ago
        I don't know, I seen to have a free compiler on my Apple laptop. And a handheld mobile OS with unprecedented capabilities people would be dreaming of just a decade ago -- that I can code for by spending like $100, including the ability to release my apps to half a billion with credit cards at the ready. Perhaps if you're young enough to only remember the "everything must be FOSS" times, and not the times we paid $100-$300 for a proprietary compiler this seems very restrictive.
        reginaldjcooper 13y ago
        I guess you can download the LLVM source but that has nothing to do with Apple. > that I can code for by spending like $100 Odd that you think that's freedom, because I can put my own apps on my own phone for actual free. I can put other people's apps on my own phone without signing up for an app store and without a third party's permission. I can send my apps to anyone I want and charge them via my own payment processor if I want. I agree we now have a "handheld mobile OS with unprecedented capabilities" and that iOS and the App Store were incredibly innovative a few years ago. But the problem is not whether or not I am allowed to develop an app, the problem is whether or not I am allowed to use my device on my terms. I couldn't even add a caller blacklist on iOS. Also let's say I without any argument accept the idea that the past was less free. That still doesn't make what Apple are doing now free in any shape or form, that's just a flat-out logical fallacy. If you have to appeal to a worse past to explain how you are relatively free you have basically conceded the argument.
- BorisMelnik 13y ago
  no, but I wouldn't be surprised if I saw intall Windows or Mac app inside of a Ubuntu store :)
- anonymfus 13y ago
  Wubi still does not support UEFI/GPT systems, but it would be very interesting thing to check.
- fidotron 13y ago
  It's not bullshit at all. The bulk of what development they're doing is now not in AOSP, but things like the Hangouts app or Play Services. The other changes are increasingly minor while stability on their own Nexus devices has gone down. For example, were you to improve the Android stock messaging app they are completely within their rights to prevent you pushing it back into AOSP, and worse, if you make a breaking change and distribute as an "improved Android" you could be classed as a fork, which violates the T&C of the SDK. Google having this veto to artificially hold back Android prevents other players from producing interesting forks of it. Cyanogenmod will be perceived as a long term threat, and so they will progressively up the stakes in order to make life difficult, but they're starting with stuff which is easier to justify. Once they've started the fanboys will find it much harder to change their tune. You can see what's been going on by their staff situation.
  - BitMastro 13y ago
    I don't think so, there's a lot of development in AOSP as well, Hangouts and Play Services are only getting major visibility because they can be deployed to all versions of Android without waiting for the manufacturers. On the other end, I think that forks with breaking changes could lead to fragmentation, where some stuff works in a fork and doesn't in the other. Isn't that the definition of breaking change?
nexx 13y ago
Made an account just to remind you that Cyanogenmod installer brickled many phones. It's totally normal for them to remove it.
- enraged_camel 13y ago
  Yep. They do not want the fact that a major weakness of Android as a platform (openness = the ability to fuck up your phone) is being highlighted.
  - pwnna 13y ago
    Wait. I thought the ability to fuck up your phone (also known as replacing the shitty UI/crapware that your manufacture forced on you) is a major strength of Android phones?
    - shocks 13y ago
      I get it, you're both joking about how these 'flaws' allow us to do cool things with our phones - but the point being made (which you're both missing or ignoring) is that not everyone is tech-savvy like us and it's very possible for them to brick their devices.
      - pwnna 13y ago
        It is a double edge sword. I think this is too early to tell, wait to see if Google will reinstate the app after big warnings in the description.
byjove 13y ago
Did you actually read beyond the headline?! Google didn't remove the app they contacted CyanogenMod about the app being in violation of TOS because it ‘encourages users to void their warranty’ (a totally valid reason) so they voluntarily removed it to sort things out, probably will need to add a disclaimer or something. I'm not quite sure what you find so objectionable, or how relevant is you comment here.
- andyroid 13y ago
  Did you actually read beyond the headline? "They advised us to voluntarily remove the application, or they would be forced to remove it administratively." Which is like saying "He wasn't fired, he was just forced to resign".
  - byjove 13y ago
    You're missing the point, the app is in violation of the TOS, the fact that Google is in contact with the CyanogenMod team about the issues means that it's just an adjustment that is required for it to comply. There have been reports about people bricking their deviced with the app, requiring a proper warning would not be out of line.
    - andyroid 13y ago
      Yes, and that's because your point is made up. The article makes no mention of them being asked to remove it while sorting things out or "add a disclaimer or something". While it's possible that's actually what happened, it's certainly not mentioned in the article. That's just speculation on your part - which I only called out as you accused fidotron of not reading beyond the headline.
  - devindotcom 13y ago
    It's more like leaving when you're asked to instead of being kicked out by the bouncer. It seems pretty clear that it violates the TOS, but I'm sure they'll find another way in.

interpol_p 13y ago

While I view this move as hypocritical of Google, it does feel like it's in their customers' best interest. Think about it from a less technical perspective: I can install an app from the official Google Play store that voids my warranty. They can't have that on their public facing store. Google wants users to install apps, they don't want them to be afraid of voiding their warranty. It's interesting to see how things played out over the last few years. Google has been moving towards a more controlled environment, from something that was initially billed as open. Apple started completely locked down with a strong customer focus, and has cautiously been making their policies more developer friendly. I personally prefer Apple's approach, as it was always about the end user — but as a developer I was sometimes envious of Google's lenient policy. Google's assertion of control now makes me more interested in developing for their platform.

MichaelGG 13y ago
The app doesn't void your warranty. It encourages you to perform further actions that may void your warranty. Major difference. The article is clear that Google admits the app itself is not harmful.
- interpol_p 13y ago
  I don't think that's a good enough distinction. If it's from the official store it should not even indirectly lead to harming your device or warranty. If an app tells you to throw your phone in the air — and I was both the phone hardware manufacturer and app store curator — I wouldn't allow it on my store either. It's going to increase customer complaints.
  - eieio 13y ago
    Not sure if you're intentionally referencing this, but there are definitely apps in the Google Play store that explicitly encourage you to throw your phone in the air, such as Send Me To Heaven app[1] [1] https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.carrotpop.www.smth&hl=en https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.carrotpop.... (I don't actually disagree with your point, just thought it was funny)

g8oz 13y ago

It seems like no matter how blatantly Google carries out it's updated "Microsoft from the 1990's" act there will be a coterie of apologists on HN explaining away it's actions. The Cold War provided an appropriate label for this crowd: "useful idiots".

devindotcom 13y ago
This was a TOS violation, nothing 90s-Microsoft about it.
- zhuzhuor 13y ago
  quoted from the article: After reaching out to the Play team, their feedback was that though application itself is harmless, and not actually in violation of their Terms of Service,...
  - patrickaljord 13y ago
    They updated the article, the app is in violation of the TOS. > Update: Removed reference to stating the app was not in violation of TOS – this was a mischaracterization of Google’s statement.
- colechristensen 13y ago
  Having a rule in the TOS doesn't make it right. And you are right, it's not 90s-Microsoft, it's worse. I'd say it's reasonable to believe that vast majority of average users _never_ acquire software outside of the walled gardens of Mirosoft, Google, and Apple's app stores. There sure are benefits to these walled gardens, but the loss of freedom to corporate whim should be a very serious concern to everyone here.
  - thezilch 13y ago
    What freedoms were lost, exactly?
    - 13y ago

mirsadm 13y ago

I think this is completely reasonable. If people want to sideload the app then by all means go for it. The Play Store shouldn't allow apps that can potentially damage your device (or void your warranty).

ajross 13y ago
It's reasonable and not. The installer is a tool for assisted rooting. Yes, that's dangerous and voids warranties. But just search for "root" on the Play Store and you'll find thousands of apps designed to exploit and utilize that status. These are great features, and Google clearly allows them... That said, part of me is chuckling internally that CM got caught being unable to distribute their proprietary (windows-only!) "installer" solution through Google's proprietary distribution channel. There are open source paths to a solution here, and CM didn't even try...
- notatoad 13y ago
  An application that only runs if your warranty is already voided, and an application that actually voids your warranty are two very different things. You've got to remember google's position here - for the majority of phones sold, they aren't the manufacturer or the warranty provider. If they allow cyanogen in the play store and it creates a huge warranty headache for Samsung or Sony or any other OEM that includes the play store by default, it jeopardizes google's ability to distribute the Play Store.

joeblau 13y ago

When Google is saying CyanogenMod is voiding warranties, are they talking about warranties from the hardware manufacturers? It feels like the OS is open, but the Hardware is not.

cdash 13y ago
Yes. So have fun spending 800 dollars to replace your phone when it is bricked, but as expected many here instantly jumped on the google hate train.

naner 13y ago

With the CM Installer in the play store many lay-people started using it, rendering their phones unusable[1] when any little issue cropped up. Also the process wasn't foolproof even for people capable of dealing with technical issues[2]. It isn't polished enough to go in the play store IMO. I don't know WTF the cyanogenmod team was thinking, non-technical people messing with CM will just lead to negative press. 1: http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/comments/1qkfaw/cannot_uninstall_cm_version_from_the_play_store/ http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/comments/1qkfaw/cannot_uninst... 2: http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/comments/1qi5lw/official_cyanogenmod_installer_released_our_phone/cdd8bfg http://www.reddit.com/r/nexus4/comments/1qi5lw/official_cyan...

iamshs 13y ago
But that is only one person whose phone is rendered unusable and not many as you insinuate. Same thing happened with PS4 launch when people reported issues, but statistic turned out to be <1%. This app is exactly for the non-technical people to stop messing around. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/11/android-roms-the-easy-way-testing-the-new-cyanogenmod-installer/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/11/android-roms-the-easy...
- thezilch 13y ago
  The same thing did not happen with the PS4 launch; there, the consumer can get a FREE replacement of the damaged goods. Here, you're SOL. The best I can tell, this is like all of those teenagers installing Napster, Kazaa, or whatever on grandma's PC. Feds show up and "OMG, fines!? I didn't know! I'm computer dumb. I paid $10/month for all nsync!" I love what CM is doing, but if lay persons and even "experts" are getting burnt, who is responsible? Who gets blamed? Google? Because that's the first place consumers are going to go or to distributors or manufacturers who are going to also going to defer to Google.
- byjove 13y ago
  Browse the support forums of carries and device makers and you'll find plenty of such testimonials. They would brick their devices and find themselves without warranty, which is not exactly an ideal situation.

Mikeb85 13y ago

Understandable. If people don't know how to enable developer mode, Adb debugging, sideload apps, etc..., they shouldn't be messing around with modding their phone. It really doesn't belong in the Play store.

imahboob 13y ago

Well there are other ways in which you can crack an android phone, cyanogen was just a noob friendly way to do so...

davidp 13y ago

If Google knowingly allowed their app store to host software that harms carrier-supported devices, they might easily be in breach of contract with those carriers. This is a defensive move.

oddshocks 13y ago

Windows only? Are you joking around?

Zigurd 13y ago

This is less a matter of Google being evil or hypocritical. Google is just being dumb. CyanogenMod is an important part of the Android ecosystem, and should be an even more important part of that ecosystem. Google should encourage aftermarket Android distributions. They serve the customers who want a truly open source Android and they serve the orphaned devices users. It you RTFA, you see that the app has a very simple function and mostly serves to enable discovery of CyanogenMod. The actual installation requires a Windows PC.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

pilooch 13y ago

put it on fdroid

DanBC 13y ago

Customers buy a phone. That phone is loaded with terrible, awful, software and unpleasant branding. Customers want to remove that software and that branding. One way is to use scary software like Cyanogenmod. There is not other way. Maybe Google and customers need to start pressuring carriers to stop loading phones with this awful software?

thezilch 13y ago
Maybe customers should stop buying awful software? There are plenty of offerings, including Google's own phone. What more can Google do? Close off Android to crapware providers and they'll have the wrath of the community donning their pitchforks. This thread alone should be an example of how irrational some folks are, crying fowl at Google for not wanting brickware in their store.
- Macha 13y ago
  Selling their own phone in more countries would be a good start. Even in the countries where they do sell the phone, they often only sell it via their web store, so user's who don't research phones beyond walking into a phone shop don't know it exists.

icefox 13y ago

I like how http://www.cyanogenmod.org/ http://www.cyanogenmod.org/ doesn't really tell you what it is or why I would want it.

smtddr 13y ago
http://i.imgur.com/EEmBXsq.png http://i.imgur.com/EEmBXsq.png
- icefox 13y ago
  Documentation is for if I already want it, not for figuring out what the thing is. And if you follow the link to http://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/CyanogenMod_Installer http://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/CyanogenMod_Installer you still don't find any reason to use it (whatever "it" is) This question is the closest, lets hope people click on it too: >Why flash CyanogenMod? >There are many reasons to consider for flashing your device. Check out our Why Mod? page for more info! http://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/Why_Mod%3F http://wiki.cyanogenmod.org/w/Why_Mod%3F Then goes on to talk about moding (I guess CyanogenMod is a "mod", but it doesn't explicitly say so right off the bat) and goes on to talk about the cons and pros of modding, but doesn't actually tell you why I would want CyanogenMod until I scroll more than a page down to a bunch of similar screenshots. So three links deep hidden in the bottom half of a wiki page is a (even complete?) feature set of CyanogenMod. Again cyanogenmod flat out fails to tell new users what they do and why I might want it on the main page. I wonder what the bounce rate on the main page is.

shmerl 13y ago

Google is a new Apple?

eDavis698 13y ago

The new CM installer nearly bricked my phone! This would be a warrenty/customer support nightmare for Verizon/ATT/Samsung/HTC/whoever. Preface: I consider myself a fairly advanced power user on linux as a hobby, and I'm a computer technician/sysadmin [Windows] by day. I've had two Android phones over the past two years. I have a Verizon Galaxy Nexus and was pissed that Verizon decided that phone was not to get 4.3 let alone Google decided no 4.4 for the Galaxy Nexus...(Each iteration of Android broke more things like speech to text.) Rather than wait for the never coming updates I started studying how to flash Cyanogenmod onto this. It looked a bit convoluted even compared to flashing firmware onto micro-contollers. Then the app hit the Play store and I figured I would give it a shot. The app showed you what settings needed changed (like enable USB debugging) and how to do them, even to the point of opening the settings screens for you. A casual user would never even be able to find the settings again after that first opening. It would be akin to going straight to the Computer Management console in Windows or loading up fstab in Linux without telling a casual end user how to get there! My install process did not go smooth. The first thing it had wrong was the connection mode, said to use Camera Mode PTP instead of MTP. That is flat out wrong for this phone and it won't connect. Then during the bootloader/rooting process, which the installer fully automatically does for you(!) a critical USB driver failed to install and it locked the phone up. The soft power button does not respond here and luckily I was able to pull the battery to reset. If this was a Nexus 4 or 5...I would have been praying that once the battery died I could still power it up for a recharge; a very good possibility it would have been bricked. Now that the software is installed I have no Photosphere in the camera and I can no longer connect to my work exchange calendar. I also managed to lose a few stored contacts somehow. I knew to backup my pictures/docs/data but a typical user would not. Now imagine a typical consumer has just purchased a Galaxy S4 on contract for $199. They flash CM onto it and now best case they call Verizon/ATT/Samsung wanting to know why feature X isn't working or why they lost the phone numbers of their friends/family – or worse their baby pictures/movies. Now that company either says 'Go fly a kite' or reflashes and they still have data loss. If the phone bricks they will be shocked to learn they will need to pony up $650 to replace it replace it!

mushroomhead 13y ago

Unlike appstore where most accounts is password protected on download because of credit card associated with their account. Most android phone user don't set such restriction, and what truth is most kids just download whatever they saw on playstore. Google did the right thing to remove a dangerous app with potential to break your device.

37prime 13y ago

I have just download CyanogenMod Installer from Google Play Store and still have it in my now Android KitKat-running Nexus 4. I intended to install CyanogenMod 10.1.3 which is based on Android Jelly Bean 4.2.2, on my nexus 4. I have not done so. --- I also have the intention to install the stock Android Jelly Bean 4.3 on the same nexus 4; downgrading from Android KitKat 4.4. I found that Android KitKat on Nexus 4 (and Nexus 5) now redirect tethering network traffic to the carrier login page, specifically T-Mobile USA. Strangely, I had no problems using the built-in tethering (Nexus 4 - Andorid KitKat combo) with AT&T network.

conradfr 13y ago
This can be disabled, just google it.
- 37prime 13y ago
  I know how to do that and it generally requires roting the device or buying an app. It really bothers me to find out that Google is taking away a feature specifically to appease T-Mobile. Pure Android experience no more.

sushirain 13y ago

A better compromise would have been to just enforce a modal warning message in the play store, such as: "Warning! This app can brick your device. Google is not responsible for its damages, and you may loose other warranties, too!" Regarding kids, that would overlook the warning, they still have to download the PC software. So the procedure isn't significantly more simplified than going directly to the website.

Create 13y ago

Fortunately, Android is open enough Well, make CyanogenMod Installer Application open enough and put it onto F-droid. Don't wan't to? Well, neither GOOG ...so much about openness PR.

IgorPartola 13y ago

This entire fiasco with the Android ecosystem stems from locked down bootloaders. How many people have bricked their PC's by installing a different OS on them? Why can we not have the same model for phones: If you brick it, some tiny bit of ROM can be invoked which connects to the Internet, downloads, verifies, and installs the latest carrier approved OS. This simple fail safe means that it is impossible to brick a phone and I bet instructions for how to initiate this reset could be made very simple. Instead, it seems that the OS and the bootloader are tightly coupled and the OS can actually screw up the bootloader, which is the root of all Android evil.

babesh 13y ago

Android isn't open. It's Google's and they want to keep it this way. iOS isn't open. It's Apple's and they want to keep it that way. The open spiel was pure marketing to gain market share. Now that they have it, they are locking things down to maintain control. Threatening decertification, requiring google play services, certification by a private party,... Now that the open argument no longer works, people are defending it as pro consumer. Hogwash. Edit: http://techcrunch.com/2013/09/18/cyanogen-mod-7m-benchmark/ http://techcrunch.com/2013/09/18/cyanogen-mod-7m-benchmark/ Cyanogen has basically become a competitor to Google

derleth 13y ago

As long as CM phones home, it shouldn't be in the Play Store.