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I don't know who came up with the "where they derive energy" explanation, but I see it mentioned as the correct answer all over the place, and I can't relate to

I don't know who came up with the "where they derive energy" explanation, but I see it mentioned as the correct answer all over the place, and I can't relate to this at all. I derive my energy from food and sleep ... Jokes aside, I have no clue what people are talking about when they say this. I don't feel energized by talking to people, and I don't feel energized by doing alone-time activities. I don't even see what energy has anything to do with having or not having interaction. I also don't think "deriving energy" is anywhere near being a measurable scientific event but rather an ill-defined handwavy concept.

hga 13y ago
Let me give you a significant and relevant to HN personal example. In the early '90s I worked for a small company where the VP of sales, who was our "closer" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closing_(sales) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closing_(sales) and I would together make critical sales calls. I'd be wearing my normal casual clothes, Oxford shirt, black jeans, New Balance 99x running shoes (grey back then, but always understated), in part for verisimilitude, and would answer all the technical questions, perhaps make a presentation of the system we were proposing to build for them. Basically convince them that we had the technical chops to get the job done, and this approach was quite successful. I might be mistaken for the non-energy model of an extrovert during one of these sessions, obviously being e.g. shy or retiring wouldn't work, nor is that in my nature. The difference I perceived between my extroverted salesmen partners and myself was that I wasn't good for much of anything the next day, as I "recharged my batteries" or whatever you want to call it; call it an "ill-defined handwavy concept" not particularly "a measurable scientific event", but I know my productivity, how it works and doesn't, going back to long before I became a programmer. So I firmly believe this phenomena exists, even if you yourself are in-between both of these "types".
Guvante 13y ago
It is incredibly important when looking at these kinds of measures to realize it is not a simple yes/no. Introvert/Extrovert. It is a range of possibilities. For instance many people are very near the center, and find both kinds of activities equally enjoyable. They don't get particularly "recharged" in that vague sense, but they never get discharged by the opposite either.
Tloewald 13y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits Extraverts are described as being "higher energy" rather than getting energy from X rather than Y. As I understand it, the big five is one of the better regarded personality measures among personality psychologists, and "Extraversion" (sic.) is one of the measures. Psychological measures are generally better regarded if they produce more repeatable results (Briggs-Meyers, which despite being discredited is still popular, also uses a -- somewhat different -- extroversion scale).
gadders 13y ago
I can relate to the energy theory. If I spend a day with people outside my close friends and family, I definitely need some "quiet time" to recover. For instance, on work trips to another office you invariably get invited out for dinner/drinks after the working day, and I'd much rather sit in my hotel room eating roomservice.
dwc 13y ago
"Energy" is a metaphor to which most people relate so it gets used a lot. Stress level might be a good thing to examine on the other side. If I spend too much time in traditionally extroverted activities I start to get fuzzy-headed and show signs of fatigue, then irritability and stress. There's a balance point where I'm at my best, and that point is when I'm getting lots of uninterrupted solitude but having daily interaction with my core group of people (family, close friends). For other people the balance point is very different. Being far away from your balance point for extended periods leaves one feeling out of sorts, stressed, and maybe even a bit desperate. I guess what I'm saying is that it's not so much that one side is a source of energy. It's just normal. It's more that the opposite side is draining.
deelowe 13y ago
After spending a full afternoon at a dinner party with colleagues, do you feel a) happy, refreshed, and ready to do it again tomorrow or b) drained, tired and wanting to just be alone for a while to recuperate? I'm the latter, which is traditionally classified as introverted. To flip it around, the extrovert would feel drained, tired, and wanting of some social interaction after spending an afternoon sitting in front of a computer (my wife is like this). Energy is a metaphor for the "stress level," of the individual for lack of a better term.
- bkj123 13y ago
  I'm the same and did not discover this until about the 5th time I took the Myers-Briggs Personality Test. My initial tests had me almost exactly between extroversion and introversion. On my last test, the facilitator explained the energy/stress aspect with a number of examples like your dinner party. She also mentioned people are naturally one or the other, not 50/50. I realized that my natural inclination was introversion. I believe that what I perceived as my extroverted side was learned through a social upbringing to engage others, which is beneficial. There are a number of social/extroverted things that I sincerely enjoy but I walk away exhausted.
nawitus 13y ago
I think that the "introverts just need energy for social interaction" is a recent innovation created by non-specialists, and the word "introvert" used to mean just that - the opposite of extrovert. Wikipedia states that the 'energy explanation' is a characterization by a few popular writers: "Some popular writers have characterized introverts as people whose energy tends to expand through reflection and dwindle during interaction." - Wikipedia (Introvert) I've seen the 'energy explanation' repeated in social media like hundreds of times. They start by saying that everyone who belives that introversion is the opposite of extroversion is false, even though they're themselves focusing on a theory fully supported only by popular writers. Perhaps in 10 years the classical definition of the word 'introvert' is lost and the 'energy explanation' wins, because for some reason it spreads like wildfire in social media. My own gut-feeling is that 'introvertism' has been high-status social quality in certain social circles (e.g. 'nerds'), and now some people feel like they want to attribute it to themselves.

hga 13y ago

Let me give you a significant and relevant to HN personal example. In the early '90s I worked for a small company where the VP of sales, who was our "closer" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closing_(sales) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closing_(sales) and I would together make critical sales calls. I'd be wearing my normal casual clothes, Oxford shirt, black jeans, New Balance 99x running shoes (grey back then, but always understated), in part for verisimilitude, and would answer all the technical questions, perhaps make a presentation of the system we were proposing to build for them. Basically convince them that we had the technical chops to get the job done, and this approach was quite successful. I might be mistaken for the non-energy model of an extrovert during one of these sessions, obviously being e.g. shy or retiring wouldn't work, nor is that in my nature. The difference I perceived between my extroverted salesmen partners and myself was that I wasn't good for much of anything the next day, as I "recharged my batteries" or whatever you want to call it; call it an "ill-defined handwavy concept" not particularly "a measurable scientific event", but I know my productivity, how it works and doesn't, going back to long before I became a programmer. So I firmly believe this phenomena exists, even if you yourself are in-between both of these "types".

Guvante 13y ago

It is incredibly important when looking at these kinds of measures to realize it is not a simple yes/no. Introvert/Extrovert. It is a range of possibilities. For instance many people are very near the center, and find both kinds of activities equally enjoyable. They don't get particularly "recharged" in that vague sense, but they never get discharged by the opposite either.

Tloewald 13y ago

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Five_personality_traits Extraverts are described as being "higher energy" rather than getting energy from X rather than Y. As I understand it, the big five is one of the better regarded personality measures among personality psychologists, and "Extraversion" (sic.) is one of the measures. Psychological measures are generally better regarded if they produce more repeatable results (Briggs-Meyers, which despite being discredited is still popular, also uses a -- somewhat different -- extroversion scale).

gadders 13y ago

I can relate to the energy theory. If I spend a day with people outside my close friends and family, I definitely need some "quiet time" to recover. For instance, on work trips to another office you invariably get invited out for dinner/drinks after the working day, and I'd much rather sit in my hotel room eating roomservice.

dwc 13y ago

"Energy" is a metaphor to which most people relate so it gets used a lot. Stress level might be a good thing to examine on the other side. If I spend too much time in traditionally extroverted activities I start to get fuzzy-headed and show signs of fatigue, then irritability and stress. There's a balance point where I'm at my best, and that point is when I'm getting lots of uninterrupted solitude but having daily interaction with my core group of people (family, close friends). For other people the balance point is very different. Being far away from your balance point for extended periods leaves one feeling out of sorts, stressed, and maybe even a bit desperate. I guess what I'm saying is that it's not so much that one side is a source of energy. It's just normal. It's more that the opposite side is draining.

deelowe 13y ago

After spending a full afternoon at a dinner party with colleagues, do you feel a) happy, refreshed, and ready to do it again tomorrow or b) drained, tired and wanting to just be alone for a while to recuperate? I'm the latter, which is traditionally classified as introverted. To flip it around, the extrovert would feel drained, tired, and wanting of some social interaction after spending an afternoon sitting in front of a computer (my wife is like this). Energy is a metaphor for the "stress level," of the individual for lack of a better term.

bkj123 13y ago
I'm the same and did not discover this until about the 5th time I took the Myers-Briggs Personality Test. My initial tests had me almost exactly between extroversion and introversion. On my last test, the facilitator explained the energy/stress aspect with a number of examples like your dinner party. She also mentioned people are naturally one or the other, not 50/50. I realized that my natural inclination was introversion. I believe that what I perceived as my extroverted side was learned through a social upbringing to engage others, which is beneficial. There are a number of social/extroverted things that I sincerely enjoy but I walk away exhausted.

nawitus 13y ago

I think that the "introverts just need energy for social interaction" is a recent innovation created by non-specialists, and the word "introvert" used to mean just that - the opposite of extrovert. Wikipedia states that the 'energy explanation' is a characterization by a few popular writers: "Some popular writers have characterized introverts as people whose energy tends to expand through reflection and dwindle during interaction." - Wikipedia (Introvert) I've seen the 'energy explanation' repeated in social media like hundreds of times. They start by saying that everyone who belives that introversion is the opposite of extroversion is false, even though they're themselves focusing on a theory fully supported only by popular writers. Perhaps in 10 years the classical definition of the word 'introvert' is lost and the 'energy explanation' wins, because for some reason it spreads like wildfire in social media. My own gut-feeling is that 'introvertism' has been high-status social quality in certain social circles (e.g. 'nerds'), and now some people feel like they want to attribute it to themselves.