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At least with Tulips your can save the dried pedals. Speculation in this won't hurt the rich boys, but the salaried boys will be very limp. Oh, finance will

At least with Tulips your can save the dried pedals. Speculation in this won't hurt the rich boys, but the salaried boys will be very limp. Oh, finance will take the theories, and code--all for free. Too bad that Japanese guy didn't patent the code, and the idea?

bingofuel 13y ago
I think he (or she) has more to gain since all of the beginning blocks were mined and probably owned by him. Side note: I don't think anyone's confirmed Satoshi Nakamoto is actually Japanese.
SwellJoe 13y ago
Why would someone choose a bank-owned Bitcoin alternative over the distributed Bitcoin? Would people rather pay more fees (my bank charges $40 for an international wire transfer...I did the same with Bitcoin for about two pennies, and that was a voluntarily paid feed)? Do people like having their finances judged by faceless corporations, and if you don't keep enough of your money in the bank, they fine you? What are the advantages that make your idea of "finance will take the theories, and code" seem plausible, to you? And, what would a patent have done to improve on the situation for anyone?
- blibble 13y ago
  ability to rollback fraudulent transactions? the knowledge you'll get most of your deposits back if the bank goes bust? (government mandated insurance schemes like FDIC/FSCS are really expensive for banks... this makes up a big part of your bank fees) the bank's capability to match up long term loans with short term deposits? people really want a 25 year mortgage, but also want instant access to their savings, the banks (mostly) match up these two incompatible goals: this is a useful function
  - fat0wl 13y ago
    yeah thats kinda my beef with this stuff too. the transaction fees you pay have a purpose its not just like banks declared they can steal from you. Bitcoin doesn't offer these services, therefore no transaction fees. and the transaction-scripting possibilities described in a lot of these comments are interesting but why couldn't banks implement the same thing? mainly because they are trying to protect you & intercept fraud etc. My ideal version of Bitcoin is more like this -- you put money in the bank & then it becomes crypto currency. You can pass it around as much as you want & then at the end of the day if you ever want cash you submit coins to the bank & get cash. It's so simple & negates a ton of Bitcoin's problems. But it's not as romantic & get rich quick-y so the community will hate it. I think the allure of the black market, "f__k the systemmm", and pyramid scheme is 90% of why bitcoin is defended so intensely. I think it's complicated legally though and that's why financiers want nothing to do with it. After all, if banks told you you could go 0% transaction fee if you incur some risk of losing your account altogether (if your wallet gets deleted or an admission that they might steal it or that you'll have to sell back your money at a new market price, plus the fact that you're entering an imbalanced market where early adopters have greater hordes of wealth for the same buy-in price) I think most customers would flat out reject it anyway. It's also a very strange approach that a lot of the arguments take where they claim that because of the distributed nature it's safer than dealing with corporations. The Bitcoin network has its own points of failure (exchanges, hello?) that users have gotten burned for trusting. They are establishing new Gods, not eliminating the concept entirely. A public record does not mean that the system has no possible points of fault. A big part of banking is controlling these possible fault points to protect customers. As with lots of corporate/gov services, they are trying to design it so that it is strong/reliable/simple-to-use/stable. Oh, and duh!! Lots of Bitcoin services (exchanges, transaction processors) CHARGE FEES! It's only when it's floating around the ecosystem ether that it is fee-less. If it gets to the level of everyday use, I'd wager there will be as many protectionary fees as with USD except maybe in certain situations: sending money to a friend, or a no-refunds type of transaction where ordinarily you'd pay cash (which incidentally is more off-the-grid than BTC would be at that point).
    - VMG 13y ago
      Happy to see you breaking your promise and return to Bitcoin :-) The problem with your suggested system is that it introduces a mandatory third party into all transactions, even where only two parties are desired. Bitcoin makes that third party optional. You're correct that there are fees, but these are much more flexible and usually much lower than current fees (see international wire transfers).
  - SilasX 13y ago
    The conventional banking system can be hit-or- miss about rolling back fraudulent transactions.
prostoalex 13y ago
As posited BitCoin is a mechanism for storing value as well as transaction information. If you have a liquid enough exchange, allowing you to enter/exit the currency within seconds, the implications of transaction protocol are pretty wide - instantaneous verified commission-free money transfers around the world. Those who choose not to use BitCoins for value storage can then safely exit into their preferred currencies.

bingofuel 13y ago

I think he (or she) has more to gain since all of the beginning blocks were mined and probably owned by him. Side note: I don't think anyone's confirmed Satoshi Nakamoto is actually Japanese.

SwellJoe 13y ago

Why would someone choose a bank-owned Bitcoin alternative over the distributed Bitcoin? Would people rather pay more fees (my bank charges $40 for an international wire transfer...I did the same with Bitcoin for about two pennies, and that was a voluntarily paid feed)? Do people like having their finances judged by faceless corporations, and if you don't keep enough of your money in the bank, they fine you? What are the advantages that make your idea of "finance will take the theories, and code" seem plausible, to you? And, what would a patent have done to improve on the situation for anyone?

blibble 13y ago
ability to rollback fraudulent transactions? the knowledge you'll get most of your deposits back if the bank goes bust? (government mandated insurance schemes like FDIC/FSCS are really expensive for banks... this makes up a big part of your bank fees) the bank's capability to match up long term loans with short term deposits? people really want a 25 year mortgage, but also want instant access to their savings, the banks (mostly) match up these two incompatible goals: this is a useful function
- fat0wl 13y ago
  yeah thats kinda my beef with this stuff too. the transaction fees you pay have a purpose its not just like banks declared they can steal from you. Bitcoin doesn't offer these services, therefore no transaction fees. and the transaction-scripting possibilities described in a lot of these comments are interesting but why couldn't banks implement the same thing? mainly because they are trying to protect you & intercept fraud etc. My ideal version of Bitcoin is more like this -- you put money in the bank & then it becomes crypto currency. You can pass it around as much as you want & then at the end of the day if you ever want cash you submit coins to the bank & get cash. It's so simple & negates a ton of Bitcoin's problems. But it's not as romantic & get rich quick-y so the community will hate it. I think the allure of the black market, "f__k the systemmm", and pyramid scheme is 90% of why bitcoin is defended so intensely. I think it's complicated legally though and that's why financiers want nothing to do with it. After all, if banks told you you could go 0% transaction fee if you incur some risk of losing your account altogether (if your wallet gets deleted or an admission that they might steal it or that you'll have to sell back your money at a new market price, plus the fact that you're entering an imbalanced market where early adopters have greater hordes of wealth for the same buy-in price) I think most customers would flat out reject it anyway. It's also a very strange approach that a lot of the arguments take where they claim that because of the distributed nature it's safer than dealing with corporations. The Bitcoin network has its own points of failure (exchanges, hello?) that users have gotten burned for trusting. They are establishing new Gods, not eliminating the concept entirely. A public record does not mean that the system has no possible points of fault. A big part of banking is controlling these possible fault points to protect customers. As with lots of corporate/gov services, they are trying to design it so that it is strong/reliable/simple-to-use/stable. Oh, and duh!! Lots of Bitcoin services (exchanges, transaction processors) CHARGE FEES! It's only when it's floating around the ecosystem ether that it is fee-less. If it gets to the level of everyday use, I'd wager there will be as many protectionary fees as with USD except maybe in certain situations: sending money to a friend, or a no-refunds type of transaction where ordinarily you'd pay cash (which incidentally is more off-the-grid than BTC would be at that point).
  - VMG 13y ago
    Happy to see you breaking your promise and return to Bitcoin :-) The problem with your suggested system is that it introduces a mandatory third party into all transactions, even where only two parties are desired. Bitcoin makes that third party optional. You're correct that there are fees, but these are much more flexible and usually much lower than current fees (see international wire transfers).
- SilasX 13y ago
  The conventional banking system can be hit-or- miss about rolling back fraudulent transactions.

prostoalex 13y ago

As posited BitCoin is a mechanism for storing value as well as transaction information. If you have a liquid enough exchange, allowing you to enter/exit the currency within seconds, the implications of transaction protocol are pretty wide - instantaneous verified commission-free money transfers around the world. Those who choose not to use BitCoins for value storage can then safely exit into their preferred currencies.