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Worst linkbait title ever? In fact, the entire post ridiculously manipulative. Doctorow is not doing anybody any favors by going into full tin-foil-hat-speak to

Worst linkbait title ever? In fact, the entire post ridiculously manipulative. Doctorow is not doing anybody any favors by going into full tin-foil-hat-speak to disguise the facts. "Germany" is not "threatening" anybody. Malamud is getting sued by what is only referred to as the mysterious "the code people". (Which is actually DIN, an internationally well known standardisation institution, not need to refer to them as some shady gang.) All of this happens to take place in Germany. The facts are bad enough without this kind of nonsense.

throwawaykf 13y ago
I really wish people would realize outlets like BoingBoing, Techdirt and the like are just trolling for rage-views.
thomasz 13y ago
DIN is the German ANSI
- chalst 13y ago
  Like ANSI, DIN is not a branch of government, but a self-regulated non-profit institute (an e.V.) Their FAQ describes their relationship to the government: > What is the role of the government or the European Commission in standardization? > Standardization is a form of economic self-regulation, relieving the state of the responsibility for developing detailed technical specifications while ensuring that a standard reflects the state of technology. Because the state has an interest in standardization, particularly in the occupational safety and health sectors, it funds DIN projects in sectors which are in the public interest. http://www.din.de/cmd?cmsrubid=55343&menurubricid=55343&level=tpl-rubrik&menuid=47566&languageid=en&cmsareaid=47566#Role%20of%20government http://www.din.de/cmd?cmsrubid=55343&menurubricid=55343&leve...
  - belorn 13y ago
    So let me see if I understand this right. The EU has created several safety laws that each countries must follow. The laws then in turn reference proprietary written standards by DIN, which people need to buy in order to actually follow and understand the law. Is that correct?
    - chalst 13y ago
      I don't know about ANSI, but the IEEE is a US non-profit standards body, and you need to buy its standards to claim compliance with them. This, and fees for testing products, is generally how non-governmental standards institutes fund themselves.
      - varjag 13y ago
        You also have to pay for ANSI/NIST standard texts, ITU, ISO standards, and for EU industrial standard texts. It's nothing out of ordinary. EDIT: I see ITU has made their standards free of charge since 2007.
    - ThePhysicist 13y ago
      Yes, and no. DIN basically takes European and international norms and translates them so that they conform to the German law and can thus be used in Germany. This is not just a matter of simple translation but of adaptation since all documents issued by the European Union are published in all languages of the member states anyway. Companies could of course just take the European norms and implement them by themselves, but since adapting these norms to German law is complicated they choose to buy a certified DIN report which provides them legal security. Now you can of course argue if this service should be provided for free or not. On their website, DIN points out a few reasons why they charge money for their reports: http://www.din.de/cmd?cmsrubid=197041&menurubricid=197041&level=tpl-rubrik&menuid=47562&languageid=en&cmsareaid=47562 http://www.din.de/cmd?cmsrubid=197041&menurubricid=197041&le... So basically it's not Germany that "threatens" the guy which published these norms, but a company suing an individual for publishing copyrighted work.
      - belorn 13y ago
        Is the standard referencing the law, or the law referencing the standard? The distinction between those two are quite important.
        Tomte 13y ago
thirdsun 13y ago
It might be relevant to mention that Hamburg's district court is the court of choice for copyright holders - this court has quite a long history of ruling in favor of media corporations when it comes to issues of piracy, copyright disputes and similar subjects.
nhebb 13y ago
I used to work for a medical device manufacturer that had to comply with IEC 60601 (among others standards). Compliance with these standards was required by law, but the IEC and ISO documentation was not free. However, the underlying principal is that by purchasing copies of the standards, companies are subsidizing the creation and maintenance of the safety standards. In short it's kind of regulatory fee. I applaud Malamud's efforts for some of the documents he has made available, but since the DIN is not a government agency, this is basically like making a copy of the ISO 9000 standards available for free download.
- Zenst 13y ago
  Or you could view it as a monopoly with no competition. In effect it is a protection system. When viewed that way it is easy too see how people could become upset entering into these areas. With that it is easy to see how such articles get written in such styles on the internet or indeed tabloids as it is a formula of panic that has served media well for too long.
  - Tomte 13y ago
    It's not exactly a monopoly You can buy it from ANSI or BSI, as well. If you don't insist on the German language version (even then, the Austrians probably have another version). Remember those C and C++ PDF standards, that ANSI sold for $18, later $30, despite the competition selling for two hundred or whatever? But sure, it's not a really competitive market.

throwawaykf 13y ago

I really wish people would realize outlets like BoingBoing, Techdirt and the like are just trolling for rage-views.

thomasz 13y ago

DIN is the German ANSI

chalst 13y ago
Like ANSI, DIN is not a branch of government, but a self-regulated non-profit institute (an e.V.) Their FAQ describes their relationship to the government: > What is the role of the government or the European Commission in standardization? > Standardization is a form of economic self-regulation, relieving the state of the responsibility for developing detailed technical specifications while ensuring that a standard reflects the state of technology. Because the state has an interest in standardization, particularly in the occupational safety and health sectors, it funds DIN projects in sectors which are in the public interest. http://www.din.de/cmd?cmsrubid=55343&menurubricid=55343&level=tpl-rubrik&menuid=47566&languageid=en&cmsareaid=47566#Role%20of%20government http://www.din.de/cmd?cmsrubid=55343&menurubricid=55343&leve...
- belorn 13y ago
  So let me see if I understand this right. The EU has created several safety laws that each countries must follow. The laws then in turn reference proprietary written standards by DIN, which people need to buy in order to actually follow and understand the law. Is that correct?
  - chalst 13y ago
    I don't know about ANSI, but the IEEE is a US non-profit standards body, and you need to buy its standards to claim compliance with them. This, and fees for testing products, is generally how non-governmental standards institutes fund themselves.
    - varjag 13y ago
      You also have to pay for ANSI/NIST standard texts, ITU, ISO standards, and for EU industrial standard texts. It's nothing out of ordinary. EDIT: I see ITU has made their standards free of charge since 2007.
  - ThePhysicist 13y ago
    Yes, and no. DIN basically takes European and international norms and translates them so that they conform to the German law and can thus be used in Germany. This is not just a matter of simple translation but of adaptation since all documents issued by the European Union are published in all languages of the member states anyway. Companies could of course just take the European norms and implement them by themselves, but since adapting these norms to German law is complicated they choose to buy a certified DIN report which provides them legal security. Now you can of course argue if this service should be provided for free or not. On their website, DIN points out a few reasons why they charge money for their reports: http://www.din.de/cmd?cmsrubid=197041&menurubricid=197041&level=tpl-rubrik&menuid=47562&languageid=en&cmsareaid=47562 http://www.din.de/cmd?cmsrubid=197041&menurubricid=197041&le... So basically it's not Germany that "threatens" the guy which published these norms, but a company suing an individual for publishing copyrighted work.
    - belorn 13y ago
      Is the standard referencing the law, or the law referencing the standard? The distinction between those two are quite important.
      - Tomte 13y ago

thirdsun 13y ago

It might be relevant to mention that Hamburg's district court is the court of choice for copyright holders - this court has quite a long history of ruling in favor of media corporations when it comes to issues of piracy, copyright disputes and similar subjects.

nhebb 13y ago

I used to work for a medical device manufacturer that had to comply with IEC 60601 (among others standards). Compliance with these standards was required by law, but the IEC and ISO documentation was not free. However, the underlying principal is that by purchasing copies of the standards, companies are subsidizing the creation and maintenance of the safety standards. In short it's kind of regulatory fee. I applaud Malamud's efforts for some of the documents he has made available, but since the DIN is not a government agency, this is basically like making a copy of the ISO 9000 standards available for free download.

Zenst 13y ago
Or you could view it as a monopoly with no competition. In effect it is a protection system. When viewed that way it is easy too see how people could become upset entering into these areas. With that it is easy to see how such articles get written in such styles on the internet or indeed tabloids as it is a formula of panic that has served media well for too long.
- Tomte 13y ago
  It's not exactly a monopoly You can buy it from ANSI or BSI, as well. If you don't insist on the German language version (even then, the Austrians probably have another version). Remember those C and C++ PDF standards, that ANSI sold for $18, later $30, despite the competition selling for two hundred or whatever? But sure, it's not a really competitive market.