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This is like copy-pasting commands from the Gentoo wiki so you "learn Linux". You don't learn shit, you just insert tab A into slot B, then play Minecraft. Loo

by jff 13y ago

This is like copy-pasting commands from the Gentoo wiki so you "learn Linux". You don't learn shit, you just insert tab A into slot B, then play Minecraft. Look at the list of things you can "build". You don't actually make any of those things: >Build... >A computer, powered by Raspberry Pi Meaning: "stick it in a pre-made case" > Games like Pong, Snake Either you're playing the installed games, or writing your own... like you could do with any other computer out there. No kit required. > Music and sounds Translation: we have a speaker! > HD video Well, you're not going to be rendering any video on that little ARM processor, but I guess you can play HD video just like every other Pi. > A speaker Comes with a 1/8" connector just like fucking headphones > Towers of dynamite (...in Minecraft) Give me a break. > A wireless server Closest you'll get to building anything, although what might you serve? Well, you can serve anything with a package in Raspbian, no kit required. >A custom case, with stickers, decals, or any printed design You're not building this, it's built for you. Do they remember what this list was titled? It was titled "Build..." not "Included in the package:" > Most Debian Linux packages When I think of "building" a package, I think of compilation. At this point, though, their original concept of a list of things you can build has broken down until it's just a feature list. Every single thing on this list, except for that bullshit about stickers, is just software that you run on a Pi. Pathetic.

djhworld 13y ago
> This is like copy-pasting commands from the Gentoo wiki so you "learn Linux". I think you're being a little bit harsh there. When I was 14-15 this is exactly what I did when stepping into the world of Linux. Initially I installed Mandrake and couldn't understand how to do anything or how things were different from Windows. So I gave Gentoo a try and the installation process was pretty heavy going. Yes I didn't really "learn" everything about Linux from just following the instructions, but it did get me used to the command line and how to get around the system. That initial education helped me become more confident about learning how to use Linux and how to fix issues when they arose. I'm 26 now and use OSX as my primary choice, but I love tinkering away in the command line, like an old friend.
- sliverstorm 13y ago
  For me, slackware & gentoo were my introduction. Certainly copy-pasting didn't teach me much, but the gentoo build process was wildly unstable at the time, and fixing the many problems that arose was what really taught me about linux.
awhitty 13y ago
I agree with your assessment that this isn't really "building" a computer/etc., but I think your tone is unwarranted here. This looks like a high-quality RPi starter kit, for which there is still a niche. Their "build" fluff is just for marketing to parents of aspiring hardware hackers, and if it means more kids get to start hacking around on a Raspberry Pi, I'm totally okay with it.
- redacted 13y ago
  Haters gonna hate, as they say. Scorn-filled rants filled with pedantry rather than substantial criticisms tend to collect the majority of internet points on HN. It has been this way for years, and it seems likely to remain this way.
- jff 13y ago
  I think it's a pretty nice RPi starter kit. Speaker, wifi, keyboard, great! I just don't like the bullshit marketing they've put on it. The kids will probably enjoy snapping together the parts, but then you're done. Now it's a sealed-up Minecraft box. A bigger focus on, say, a suite of kid-oriented programming tools would have been better.
  - ArekDymalski 13y ago
    You're right - putting more emphasis on tools beyond Scratch and Codeacademy would be cool. And regarding the marketing I personally appreciate it. It's clearly prepared for nonhackerish people and does the job well - creates the feeling of accessibility and encouragement. That's something the tech world lacks generally (and often is proud of). Kano reminds me somehow what Apple did with iphone - bringing simple, easy solution that ordinary people love. And they were also criticized by pundits at the beginning.
etler 13y ago
Kids don't have standards as high as yours. I'm sure kids would get a kick out of it, even if they aren't really building something. I think it would help get them to be less intimidated by an expensive and complicated looking circuit board, and that's a great thing. I mean, I'm still intimidated by exposed circuit boards. They're expensive and I don't want to accidentally break it. There's not a whole lot to it, but it's still probably enough to get kids excited and interested. Remember, when you go under the basic interface for a computer, it's very very intimidating to non technical people. If you read through, the bulk of the project is more about programming. Putting together the computer parts and customizing it is more about getting the kids in the right mindset, and giving them a confidence boost. "You just built a computer! Now programming should be more fun!" If you want to teach your kids about electronics, not programming, then building a radio or doing experiments with a breadboard would be a much better project, but this could be a good stepping stone to that as well.
DanBC 13y ago
Jesus fucking christ - it's aimed at 8 year olds, comes with guides for their "Kano Blocks" language (Scratch, Blockly, etc) and their Kano OS. EDIT:
Zenst 13y ago
Your right, but anybody who can see any of those aspects would not be the target audience for what they are doing. Documentation would appear to be the added value. So with that it can do no harm. Price wise it would seem to be very fair as well given bundle deals (http://www.maplin.co.uk/raspberry-pi-pro-kit-783586 http://www.maplin.co.uk/raspberry-pi-pro-kit-783586 I'm thinking of being in the UK) and with the extra primary school level approach documentation then this only makes it more suitable towards the target market. Remember not all parents are computer aware beyond a browser and word document. Indeed I'd say it would be very close to 100% of all hacker news readers have installed a Operating system and that in itself is not the target audience this kickstarter is aimed at. That is why your right in everything you say and still as wrong akin too telling a child there is no Santa :).
10098 13y ago
You're right, but I'd rather buy a kid this than an iPad. At least it's somewhat educational.
sanderjd 13y ago
If this was aimed at college students you'd be spot on, but it's aimed at children. The first computer I "built" involved plugging cards I bought off e-bay into the sockets they fit into - doesn't seem too tough now, but I'll be damned if I didn't feel like I was really doing and learning back then. The fact of the matter is that in a world of iPads and laptops, simply plugging a bunch of stuff together is a very valuable and educational experience for a kid.

by jff 13y ago

djhworld 13y ago

> This is like copy-pasting commands from the Gentoo wiki so you "learn Linux". I think you're being a little bit harsh there. When I was 14-15 this is exactly what I did when stepping into the world of Linux. Initially I installed Mandrake and couldn't understand how to do anything or how things were different from Windows. So I gave Gentoo a try and the installation process was pretty heavy going. Yes I didn't really "learn" everything about Linux from just following the instructions, but it did get me used to the command line and how to get around the system. That initial education helped me become more confident about learning how to use Linux and how to fix issues when they arose. I'm 26 now and use OSX as my primary choice, but I love tinkering away in the command line, like an old friend.

sliverstorm 13y ago
For me, slackware & gentoo were my introduction. Certainly copy-pasting didn't teach me much, but the gentoo build process was wildly unstable at the time, and fixing the many problems that arose was what really taught me about linux.

awhitty 13y ago

I agree with your assessment that this isn't really "building" a computer/etc., but I think your tone is unwarranted here. This looks like a high-quality RPi starter kit, for which there is still a niche. Their "build" fluff is just for marketing to parents of aspiring hardware hackers, and if it means more kids get to start hacking around on a Raspberry Pi, I'm totally okay with it.

redacted 13y ago
Haters gonna hate, as they say. Scorn-filled rants filled with pedantry rather than substantial criticisms tend to collect the majority of internet points on HN. It has been this way for years, and it seems likely to remain this way.
jff 13y ago
I think it's a pretty nice RPi starter kit. Speaker, wifi, keyboard, great! I just don't like the bullshit marketing they've put on it. The kids will probably enjoy snapping together the parts, but then you're done. Now it's a sealed-up Minecraft box. A bigger focus on, say, a suite of kid-oriented programming tools would have been better.
- ArekDymalski 13y ago
  You're right - putting more emphasis on tools beyond Scratch and Codeacademy would be cool. And regarding the marketing I personally appreciate it. It's clearly prepared for nonhackerish people and does the job well - creates the feeling of accessibility and encouragement. That's something the tech world lacks generally (and often is proud of). Kano reminds me somehow what Apple did with iphone - bringing simple, easy solution that ordinary people love. And they were also criticized by pundits at the beginning.

etler 13y ago

Kids don't have standards as high as yours. I'm sure kids would get a kick out of it, even if they aren't really building something. I think it would help get them to be less intimidated by an expensive and complicated looking circuit board, and that's a great thing. I mean, I'm still intimidated by exposed circuit boards. They're expensive and I don't want to accidentally break it. There's not a whole lot to it, but it's still probably enough to get kids excited and interested. Remember, when you go under the basic interface for a computer, it's very very intimidating to non technical people. If you read through, the bulk of the project is more about programming. Putting together the computer parts and customizing it is more about getting the kids in the right mindset, and giving them a confidence boost. "You just built a computer! Now programming should be more fun!" If you want to teach your kids about electronics, not programming, then building a radio or doing experiments with a breadboard would be a much better project, but this could be a good stepping stone to that as well.

DanBC 13y ago

Jesus fucking christ - it's aimed at 8 year olds, comes with guides for their "Kano Blocks" language (Scratch, Blockly, etc) and their Kano OS. EDIT:

Zenst 13y ago

Your right, but anybody who can see any of those aspects would not be the target audience for what they are doing. Documentation would appear to be the added value. So with that it can do no harm. Price wise it would seem to be very fair as well given bundle deals (http://www.maplin.co.uk/raspberry-pi-pro-kit-783586 http://www.maplin.co.uk/raspberry-pi-pro-kit-783586 I'm thinking of being in the UK) and with the extra primary school level approach documentation then this only makes it more suitable towards the target market. Remember not all parents are computer aware beyond a browser and word document. Indeed I'd say it would be very close to 100% of all hacker news readers have installed a Operating system and that in itself is not the target audience this kickstarter is aimed at. That is why your right in everything you say and still as wrong akin too telling a child there is no Santa :).

10098 13y ago

You're right, but I'd rather buy a kid this than an iPad. At least it's somewhat educational.

sanderjd 13y ago

If this was aimed at college students you'd be spot on, but it's aimed at children. The first computer I "built" involved plugging cards I bought off e-bay into the sockets they fit into - doesn't seem too tough now, but I'll be damned if I didn't feel like I was really doing and learning back then. The fact of the matter is that in a world of iPads and laptops, simply plugging a bunch of stuff together is a very valuable and educational experience for a kid.