Your point is; how can you call suicide a bad or evil thing if it relieves pain and suffering in exactly the same way that the traditional definition of euthana

Your point is; how can you call suicide a bad or evil thing if it relieves pain and suffering in exactly the same way that the traditional definition of euthanasia does. I very much appreciate you reaching out in such a way. It helps to know that we're working toward an understanding of perspectives, instead of arguing. Thank you. That is not quite my point. I do accept the possibility of a "dishonorable" or "reckless" suicide, but I suspect such cases are the exception, rather than rule, given the significant taboo suicide carries today. My point is; suicide prevention isn't just about demonising suicide, the act, but about helping people not get to the point where they feel/know that suicide is the only option. Re: "isn't just about demonising suicide", the demonization of suicide is one of the key issues that I was getting at in my post. It hurts everyone involved. Family members wake up one day only to find their loved one dead all of a sudden. This happens because of said demonization. It wouldn't happen if suicide weren't illegal, if people weren't locked up against their will when they say they are suicidal, etc. A suicidal person should be free to talk about killing themselves with those close to them without fear of loss of liberty, social ostracization, and chemical rape. A son, father, daughter, mother, wife, husband, should be able to speak openly with their family about wanting out. Unfortunately, it seems our society is not mature enough for such conversation, and thus suicide becomes an agony for all involved. The person who killed themselves went through extra guilt and agony, and those surviving are also left feeling guilty, indignant, upset, angry, depressed, etc. It doesn't have to be that way. Re: "not get to the point where they feel/know that suicide is the only option", I can't comment on that without a concrete example. People get sideswiped and end up close to the edge. It can happen gradually, or very suddenly. Each situation is unique, and must be treated as such.