4 ms·

> Simple grids and data entry type input stuff is simple to do in web apps. Well, for an appropriately narrow and trivial sense of "simple" I'd agree. I mean,

> Simple grids and data entry type input stuff is simple to do in web apps. Well, for an appropriately narrow and trivial sense of "simple" I'd agree. I mean, if all you're talking about is "input number/text into box, press 'Save'" then sure, that's "simple." I don't think I've ever witnessed a business web app with such trivial requirements, though. After they've been through the "me, too!" (e.g., for "visibility", people will insist on the inclusion of feature X, even if it's not really necessary) and political/gossip/clique infighting grinders most such apps have ridiculous requirements that blow the complexity way up.

Silhouette 13y ago
Well, for an appropriately narrow and trivial sense of "simple" I'd agree. I think the biggest lesson we've learned from the rise of web apps is that most business applications are simple. They come down to some sort of database, some sort of guided processes for using it, and some sort of structured user interface for data entry and reporting. These systems are inherently centralised anyway because of the shared data store that they are built on, so running the whole thing centrally and using dumb(ish) clients is a natural fit. This doesn't mean that all business software is suitable for running as a web app. If you're creating material rather than merely entering data -- writing a report, drawing a diagram, anything like that -- web apps are still many years behind native applications in what they can do. The more significant the creation, the more this effect takes over: when was the last time you saw a professional architect or engineer doing their CAD and rendering work in a web app, or a programmer working on a million lines of code in Google IDE? But it turns out that a lot of what people do with computers is more about simple data entry and then information consumption, and you don't need all the downsides of native applications for that. In a way, Microsoft and the like decided their own fate, because they made deployment and maintenance of native applications so onerous. If they'd had a standardised and robust deployment/upgrade facility for third party software on Windows years ago, including good support for centralised management by IT departments in the professional levels of Windows used by organisations, we might have had a different picture today. If they'd also maintained the focus they used to have on trying to provide backward compatibility at almost any cost, and developed new technologies incrementally rather than making big announcement where you just assumed their new thing would be dead in 3-5 years, I'm pretty sure they'd still be a leading business in the software industry. But they didn't, so the Web and the iPad came along, and now Microsoft are just trying to keep up.
- Iftheshoefits 13y ago
  > I think the biggest lession we've learned .... True, but in that case an Excel or Access "front end" is almost certainly more than sufficient and where it isn't, whatever built-in system for writing "front-end forms" for the DB backend would be. Web applications are certainly overkill for these use cases, and native applications are even more so. However, few who use these applications are interested in thinking of their jobs as rote and easily automated, and even those who recognize and are comfortable with it will likely have managers who want to increase their visibility.

Silhouette 13y ago

Well, for an appropriately narrow and trivial sense of "simple" I'd agree. I think the biggest lesson we've learned from the rise of web apps is that most business applications are simple. They come down to some sort of database, some sort of guided processes for using it, and some sort of structured user interface for data entry and reporting. These systems are inherently centralised anyway because of the shared data store that they are built on, so running the whole thing centrally and using dumb(ish) clients is a natural fit. This doesn't mean that all business software is suitable for running as a web app. If you're creating material rather than merely entering data -- writing a report, drawing a diagram, anything like that -- web apps are still many years behind native applications in what they can do. The more significant the creation, the more this effect takes over: when was the last time you saw a professional architect or engineer doing their CAD and rendering work in a web app, or a programmer working on a million lines of code in Google IDE? But it turns out that a lot of what people do with computers is more about simple data entry and then information consumption, and you don't need all the downsides of native applications for that. In a way, Microsoft and the like decided their own fate, because they made deployment and maintenance of native applications so onerous. If they'd had a standardised and robust deployment/upgrade facility for third party software on Windows years ago, including good support for centralised management by IT departments in the professional levels of Windows used by organisations, we might have had a different picture today. If they'd also maintained the focus they used to have on trying to provide backward compatibility at almost any cost, and developed new technologies incrementally rather than making big announcement where you just assumed their new thing would be dead in 3-5 years, I'm pretty sure they'd still be a leading business in the software industry. But they didn't, so the Web and the iPad came along, and now Microsoft are just trying to keep up.

Iftheshoefits 13y ago
> I think the biggest lession we've learned .... True, but in that case an Excel or Access "front end" is almost certainly more than sufficient and where it isn't, whatever built-in system for writing "front-end forms" for the DB backend would be. Web applications are certainly overkill for these use cases, and native applications are even more so. However, few who use these applications are interested in thinking of their jobs as rote and easily automated, and even those who recognize and are comfortable with it will likely have managers who want to increase their visibility.