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I wonder why so many happiness complaints in Joel on Software forums always talk about working in "IT" (as opposed to "engineering")? I've never been referred t

by strlen 17y ago

I wonder why so many happiness complaints in Joel on Software forums always talk about working in "IT" (as opposed to "engineering")? I've never been referred to as "IT", but I've only worked in companies where producing software/Internet services was the core competency and either as production operations engineer (i.e. customer facing systems, not internal systems) or as a software engineer. Is the case with these posters that they're working in places where making a technology-oriented product/service is not the core competency (or if it is, they're not working in the departments that are responsible for core products/services)? Why do people stay in these environments, if they have/want to have any sense of passion about what they do (rather than merely think of their job as a way to make money)? The other big factor is that I am based in Silicon Valley. Could this be another factor, that outside of SF Bay Area/Seattle/Los Angeles and select other metropolitan areas anything computing-related is referred to as "IT" and treated as a cost center vs. a core competency? Seems like there's several conclusions: I. These people are passionate about a subject, but are working in an environment where passion is not expected or even appreciated. II. Either for some reason they're unwilling to switch to a field or environment where their passion will be rewarded (pay/hours/benefits?), or that option is not available to them (due to geographic locale?)

plinkplonk 17y ago
"Is the case with these posters that they're working in places where making a technology-oriented product/service is not the core competency (or if is, they're not working in the departments that are responsible for core products/services)? " Bingo! Being a software engineer (or just "programmer" if you will) for a company for which producing software is the primary business is very different from being some kind of IT "drone". Hell, even if I wanted to program for a company that did, say , insurance, I would at worst be an enterprise programmer, and those jobs , while being (relatively) boring seem more more fun than these "IT" horror stories.
mattmcknight 17y ago
Your 2nd paragraph is dead on. Working at a company where you are viewed as an overhead expense, rather than as an R&D cost is no fun. It's the third tier software job, but there are a lot of these jobs out there. I'd put working for a company that sells software as tier one and working for a software consulting company as tier two. This is why those jobs are so subject to outsourcing, if you bring in another company to take over those functions, at least the employees of that company are working towards their core competency. One "solution" to this is to get more involved in the business or mission of the organization you support. Of course, the bureaucracy may resist this sort of move.
Ennis 17y ago
Ever since I started school in Engineering I've been treated as a commodity. It's that much harder to paint yourself in a different light when most peers are fine with the status quo. It's becoming more necessary to distinguish yourself as being Mr.X who can do X, Y, Z better than anyone else in the world. Otherwise, you're just another Engineer or IT guy they hire and fire or deal with like everyone else. With so many talented Engineers coming in from Asia (hundreds of thousands a year?!) it will be harder to land a job with a decent salary if you are like everyone else.

by strlen 17y ago

plinkplonk 17y ago

"Is the case with these posters that they're working in places where making a technology-oriented product/service is not the core competency (or if is, they're not working in the departments that are responsible for core products/services)? " Bingo! Being a software engineer (or just "programmer" if you will) for a company for which producing software is the primary business is very different from being some kind of IT "drone". Hell, even if I wanted to program for a company that did, say , insurance, I would at worst be an enterprise programmer, and those jobs , while being (relatively) boring seem more more fun than these "IT" horror stories.

mattmcknight 17y ago

Your 2nd paragraph is dead on. Working at a company where you are viewed as an overhead expense, rather than as an R&D cost is no fun. It's the third tier software job, but there are a lot of these jobs out there. I'd put working for a company that sells software as tier one and working for a software consulting company as tier two. This is why those jobs are so subject to outsourcing, if you bring in another company to take over those functions, at least the employees of that company are working towards their core competency. One "solution" to this is to get more involved in the business or mission of the organization you support. Of course, the bureaucracy may resist this sort of move.

Ennis 17y ago

Ever since I started school in Engineering I've been treated as a commodity. It's that much harder to paint yourself in a different light when most peers are fine with the status quo. It's becoming more necessary to distinguish yourself as being Mr.X who can do X, Y, Z better than anyone else in the world. Otherwise, you're just another Engineer or IT guy they hire and fire or deal with like everyone else. With so many talented Engineers coming in from Asia (hundreds of thousands a year?!) it will be harder to land a job with a decent salary if you are like everyone else.