3 ms·

This is a very USA centric post. Nothing wrong with that of course. "Locked in to a single vendor? Everyone signs a multi-year contract." in the United States

This is a very USA centric post. Nothing wrong with that of course. "Locked in to a single vendor? Everyone signs a multi-year contract." in the United States. Here in India (set to become the second largest cell phone market in the world, behind China and replacing the USA by 2010), most (> 99.5%) phones are unlocked and so vendor neutral. You can switch vendors and phones independently. The Telecom Ministry is putting in place a regulation to allow phone number portability. This should happen in a couple of months and then you can switch service providers and your old cell number remains valid with the new vendor. "I predict they will dominate the market for years to come. " The US market. Sure. "and signing up for the $99 iPhone Developer Program -- can build an app and sell it to the worldwide audience of iPhone users." Rant mode on. I'll be damned if I pay 99$ a year to be "allowed" to develop software for a device I paid for. AFAIK (correct me if I am wrong) I have to pay to deploy an app on my own phone. Rant Mode off.

dinkumthinkum 17y ago
In the U.S. there is cell number portability. Also, sure you can jailbreak the phone but then that engenders a whole host of other potential problems to say nothing of the fact that that is untenable for most users.
- plinkplonk 17y ago
  "In the U.S. there is cell number portability." That's good to know. Just curious, do people even try to buy unlocked phones in the USA?
  - msbmsb 17y ago
    Unlocked phones are available at many of the big electronics retailers (best buy, frys, etc) and there are myriad cell phone stores that specialize in unlocked/imported sets.
  - evgen 17y ago
    A few do, but the vast majority do not; the cost differential is quite large. A unlocked phone will generally cost 2-3X what you would pay for a locked/subsidized phone, and since the cost to get service from any carrier is generally not going to cover the difference in price over the lifetime of the phone it is not a good option. One additional factor to consider with the US market is that we do not have a single cellphone standard; CDMA phone users can choose between Sprint or Verizon and GSM phone users can choose between AT&T or T-Mobile (there are minor prepaid players as well, but prepay and smartphones will not be a good mix until the providers figure out how to deal with the voice vs. data issue...)
    - msbmsb 17y ago
      It is possible at some cell phone stores to purchase an unlocked phone and renew a contract at the same time for a discount on the hardware. Discounts can range from $50-$200 depending on the phone and renewed plan.
yardie 17y ago
Here in the UK, FR, DE, US, and etc. you buy the iPhone on contract to get it subsidized. It costs 700$ in the US unsubsidized which is approximately what it costs (34,000Rs) in India according to Vodafone. And if you're going to buy a phone you might as well get the carrier to cover part of the costs. Except for PAYG you'll still pay way too much on your plan. Development is free. It only costs you when you go to submit it to the store. Not everyone likes a closed system but, not everyone likes to pay for something that could be done for free. But not everyone has the time to setup their own store. If you don't like the terms you are free to go to Blackberry app world (also costs money to join), or Fandango (if you thought 70/30 split was high they want 50/50). If you are really determined not to pay the fee you can jailbreak install SSH and sftp your application onto the phone. There are myriad guides on the net explaining how to accomplish this.
- plinkplonk 17y ago
  "And if you're going to buy a phone you might as well get the carrier to cover part of the costs." but that is the point. I don't want a phone locked to a particular carrier for predetermined period of time, thanks. I, and a vast majority of Indians, want the freedom to switch carriers and phones independently. That is something Indian consumers actively prefer. The IPhone in India is still locked to a specific carrier. A vast majority of phones sold in India are not. And the IPhone was a big failure in India (except for very very small numbers of apple fanboy types) and continues to have a miniscule market share, not even 1% of the market. The overall numbers sold are in the low thousands, and this in a market which grows by millions in a year. Nokia rules here, followed by Samsung and Motorola. Indian customers constantly shift plans, looking to optimize for their particular patterns of usage. They constantly change phpones, across brands. A phone locked to specific vendors or plans will never be a success here. SMS is huge in India. Incoming SMS is free and outgoing sms costs about half a rupee - a tenth of a cent - per message. A non SMS friendly phone (the original IPhone had some defects wrt sms I don't know about the latest one) will never be a success here. "If you are really determined not to pay the fee you can jailbreak install SSH and sftp your application onto the phone. " I was talking of default and legal ways to use one's cellphone. Sure any hardware can be hacked, with enough effort. I shouldn't have to do that with something I paid serious money for. "Development is free. It only costs you when you go to submit it to the store." How is development "free"? Can i deploy an app I wrote on my Iphone (without selling to other people, just for my use) without paying Apple money? I think not. Hell, even Windows ME phones allows me to deploy any application I want on my device, for my own use. " It costs 700$ in the US unsubsidized which is approximately what it costs (34,000Rs) in India according to Vodafone. " The Iphone costs 34000 Rs in India and is locked to specific vendors. And a huge failure in India. For that money I can buy a very high end unlocked phone (HTC, Nokia, RIM - yes an unlocked blackberry - <any other vendor>). Indians in general don't warm to overpriced locked phones.

dinkumthinkum 17y ago

In the U.S. there is cell number portability. Also, sure you can jailbreak the phone but then that engenders a whole host of other potential problems to say nothing of the fact that that is untenable for most users.

plinkplonk 17y ago
"In the U.S. there is cell number portability." That's good to know. Just curious, do people even try to buy unlocked phones in the USA?
- msbmsb 17y ago
  Unlocked phones are available at many of the big electronics retailers (best buy, frys, etc) and there are myriad cell phone stores that specialize in unlocked/imported sets.
- evgen 17y ago
  A few do, but the vast majority do not; the cost differential is quite large. A unlocked phone will generally cost 2-3X what you would pay for a locked/subsidized phone, and since the cost to get service from any carrier is generally not going to cover the difference in price over the lifetime of the phone it is not a good option. One additional factor to consider with the US market is that we do not have a single cellphone standard; CDMA phone users can choose between Sprint or Verizon and GSM phone users can choose between AT&T or T-Mobile (there are minor prepaid players as well, but prepay and smartphones will not be a good mix until the providers figure out how to deal with the voice vs. data issue...)
  - msbmsb 17y ago
    It is possible at some cell phone stores to purchase an unlocked phone and renew a contract at the same time for a discount on the hardware. Discounts can range from $50-$200 depending on the phone and renewed plan.

yardie 17y ago

Here in the UK, FR, DE, US, and etc. you buy the iPhone on contract to get it subsidized. It costs 700$ in the US unsubsidized which is approximately what it costs (34,000Rs) in India according to Vodafone. And if you're going to buy a phone you might as well get the carrier to cover part of the costs. Except for PAYG you'll still pay way too much on your plan. Development is free. It only costs you when you go to submit it to the store. Not everyone likes a closed system but, not everyone likes to pay for something that could be done for free. But not everyone has the time to setup their own store. If you don't like the terms you are free to go to Blackberry app world (also costs money to join), or Fandango (if you thought 70/30 split was high they want 50/50). If you are really determined not to pay the fee you can jailbreak install SSH and sftp your application onto the phone. There are myriad guides on the net explaining how to accomplish this.

plinkplonk 17y ago
"And if you're going to buy a phone you might as well get the carrier to cover part of the costs." but that is the point. I don't want a phone locked to a particular carrier for predetermined period of time, thanks. I, and a vast majority of Indians, want the freedom to switch carriers and phones independently. That is something Indian consumers actively prefer. The IPhone in India is still locked to a specific carrier. A vast majority of phones sold in India are not. And the IPhone was a big failure in India (except for very very small numbers of apple fanboy types) and continues to have a miniscule market share, not even 1% of the market. The overall numbers sold are in the low thousands, and this in a market which grows by millions in a year. Nokia rules here, followed by Samsung and Motorola. Indian customers constantly shift plans, looking to optimize for their particular patterns of usage. They constantly change phpones, across brands. A phone locked to specific vendors or plans will never be a success here. SMS is huge in India. Incoming SMS is free and outgoing sms costs about half a rupee - a tenth of a cent - per message. A non SMS friendly phone (the original IPhone had some defects wrt sms I don't know about the latest one) will never be a success here. "If you are really determined not to pay the fee you can jailbreak install SSH and sftp your application onto the phone. " I was talking of default and legal ways to use one's cellphone. Sure any hardware can be hacked, with enough effort. I shouldn't have to do that with something I paid serious money for. "Development is free. It only costs you when you go to submit it to the store." How is development "free"? Can i deploy an app I wrote on my Iphone (without selling to other people, just for my use) without paying Apple money? I think not. Hell, even Windows ME phones allows me to deploy any application I want on my device, for my own use. " It costs 700$ in the US unsubsidized which is approximately what it costs (34,000Rs) in India according to Vodafone. " The Iphone costs 34000 Rs in India and is locked to specific vendors. And a huge failure in India. For that money I can buy a very high end unlocked phone (HTC, Nokia, RIM - yes an unlocked blackberry - <any other vendor>). Indians in general don't warm to overpriced locked phones.