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A plurality of the population doesn't want full-on socialized health care. Those insisting on making it happen anyway concocted this crazy implementation as a m

A plurality of the population doesn't want full-on socialized health care. Those insisting on making it happen anyway concocted this crazy implementation as a means of squeezing something thru in that direction, quite possibly in hopes that the fallout would make "single payer" the only viable option. Yes, we're not "like the rest of the civilized world": this country was founded on valuing individual rights above the whims of the majority.

Mikeb85 13y ago
So you'd rather your government spend money on the NSA, TSA, wars on terrorism and drugs and a thousand other programs that inhibit your freedom than to ensure that the poorest, most vulnerable members of society have access to free health care?
- ctdonath 13y ago
  That's an amazing non-sequitur. ETA: just because I'm opposed to one program doesn't mean I favor others. I'm just as opposed to "NSA, TSA, wars on terrorism and drugs and a thousand other programs" as I am to Obamacare. I'm not sure how you conclude that by opposing wasteful oppression in one area somehow means I'd be more tolerant of wasteful oppression in other areas.
  - grecy 13y ago
    Please go on. If you're opposed to wasteful spending by NSA, TSA, wars on terrorism and drugs and a thousand other programs and Obamacare, where do you propose spending all those trillions?
    - jack-r-abbit 13y ago
      I can't speak for the parent here but for me I would rather them not spend so wastefully so that I don't have to give them 30% of every dollar I earn. So how about spending some of those trillions to give us all some of our taxes back.
      - grecy 13y ago
        So you'd actually be happy to lower education standards, health standards, transport, infrastructure, etc. etc. - all those things that taxes pay for. I feel obliged to point out that America is already severely behind the rest of the developed world in those things.
        jack-r-abbit 13y ago
        Did you read my comment? Because I didn't say anything even close to that. Not at all. I simply wish they would not spend so wastefully and that the money they do spend is more effective. I didn't say we should pay no taxes. I think we should pay less taxes and have that money used more efficiently.
    - ctdonath 13y ago
      We don't have those trillions. The government is borrowing near 50% of what it spends, with no idea/plan/expectation of paying it back. If any money is saved by such cuts, give the money back to the citizens who earned it and let them decide where their money should go.
toomuchtodo 13y ago
> Yes, we're not "like the rest of the civilized world": this country was founded on valuing individual rights above the whims of the majority. This is why we fail so badly as a country. Your right to previously underpay for health insurance had ended. Externalized costs are now being internalized. That's how insurance works; to spread risk across everyone. Now, if you're unhappy with that, I suggest either leaving the country or simply not paying for insurance and paying the IRS-imposed fine. You can then self-insure and absorb any of your healthcare costs yourself.

Mikeb85 13y ago

So you'd rather your government spend money on the NSA, TSA, wars on terrorism and drugs and a thousand other programs that inhibit your freedom than to ensure that the poorest, most vulnerable members of society have access to free health care?

ctdonath 13y ago
That's an amazing non-sequitur. ETA: just because I'm opposed to one program doesn't mean I favor others. I'm just as opposed to "NSA, TSA, wars on terrorism and drugs and a thousand other programs" as I am to Obamacare. I'm not sure how you conclude that by opposing wasteful oppression in one area somehow means I'd be more tolerant of wasteful oppression in other areas.
- grecy 13y ago
  Please go on. If you're opposed to wasteful spending by NSA, TSA, wars on terrorism and drugs and a thousand other programs and Obamacare, where do you propose spending all those trillions?
  - jack-r-abbit 13y ago
    I can't speak for the parent here but for me I would rather them not spend so wastefully so that I don't have to give them 30% of every dollar I earn. So how about spending some of those trillions to give us all some of our taxes back.
    - grecy 13y ago
      So you'd actually be happy to lower education standards, health standards, transport, infrastructure, etc. etc. - all those things that taxes pay for. I feel obliged to point out that America is already severely behind the rest of the developed world in those things.
      - jack-r-abbit 13y ago
        Did you read my comment? Because I didn't say anything even close to that. Not at all. I simply wish they would not spend so wastefully and that the money they do spend is more effective. I didn't say we should pay no taxes. I think we should pay less taxes and have that money used more efficiently.
  - ctdonath 13y ago
    We don't have those trillions. The government is borrowing near 50% of what it spends, with no idea/plan/expectation of paying it back. If any money is saved by such cuts, give the money back to the citizens who earned it and let them decide where their money should go.

toomuchtodo 13y ago

> Yes, we're not "like the rest of the civilized world": this country was founded on valuing individual rights above the whims of the majority. This is why we fail so badly as a country. Your right to previously underpay for health insurance had ended. Externalized costs are now being internalized. That's how insurance works; to spread risk across everyone. Now, if you're unhappy with that, I suggest either leaving the country or simply not paying for insurance and paying the IRS-imposed fine. You can then self-insure and absorb any of your healthcare costs yourself.