4 ms·

If we're going that way, what about adults who have below 100 IQ? Or people suffering some mental disorder -- eating disorder, drug addiction, depression, impu

by selmnoo 13y ago

If we're going that way, what about adults who have below 100 IQ? Or people suffering some mental disorder -- eating disorder, drug addiction, depression, impulse control disorder, poor memory, etc. They're not capable of properly evaluating things and making informed buying choices either. I can assure you that my 11 year old niece will make better buying decisions that benefit her in all sorts of ways, than the homeless guy down the street, who I suspect is under a serious bout of depression. I'm not being flippant, I'm interested in reading the logic you're operating on. I don't see how you can argue that there are moral considerations when advertising to children, but then ignore a really significant part of the population that is also being exploited in pretty much the same way. Either advertising has moral hazards all around for everyone of impaired and/or undeveloped intelligence -- young and old, or it doesn't. I don't see how you can pick and choose.

harryh 13y ago
Yes, if you're marketing something specifically targeted at people with an "eating disorder, drug addiction, depression, impulse control disorder, poor memory, etc." than you have moral considerations above and beyond products targeted at regular adults.
- selmnoo 13y ago
  That is a cop-out answer. Consider what's being advertised to people who have the aforementioned mental disorders: Eating disorder = fast foods of all sorts, Mcdonald's, KFC, Burger King, etc. ice cream, chips, candies. None of this is extremely "healthy". Conversely on the other side, in which people avoid food, there is diet pills, weight loss through questionable means, etc. Drug addiction = alcohol, tobacco (though there is less of this now) Depression, impulse control disorder, and poor memory are conditions that affect buying decisions on a wide array of things, sort of catch-all conditions. A lot of people have these disorders. But there's been no effort made to do anything about this, with respect to how advertisements affect these folk. I would also like to point out something about the power of the two types of things sold here -- things that are definitely bad for you (alcohol, unhealthy food, expensive toys (because they leave you with less money to buy good food)), and dolls. I think one can reasonably defend the point that things being marketed to adults with poor decision-making skills harm them more than little girls being shown advertisements of dolls or whatever.
  - harryh 13y ago
    Toys are marketed to children and only children. Fast food (to pick your first example) is marketed to basically everyone not specifically to people that have eating disorders. But this isn't black & white. Many people do, in fact, have moral problems with the marketing techniques of the fast food/junk food industry despite that fact that most of their customers are fully capable adults. These people have made efforts to limit what they can do, and I think most reasonable people would at least agree that their proposals are worth considering. Finally, I'm not sure about your last point about "more harm." Doll marketing is a part of a very serious sexism we have in our country. Surely it's only a small part, but it's a very serious problem. It's hard to quantify these things to make comparisons.
    - selmnoo 13y ago
      Before we get farther into this, consider the results of the two. What's the worst that will happen if kids are being advertised toys? They'll ask their parents to buy them? Maybe buy them themselves? Okay. Maybe not a prudent choice, time is wasted, a little bit of money is wasted... but the trajectory of life is very rarely totally devastated because of this. This is unlikely to happen anyway, considering there are already safeguard measures set up in society to prevent things going wrong: kids can't buy Mature-rated game, they typically don't have money anyway... parents have to make decisions for them. Mentally challenged adults have very little, if any, resources and safeguards to save them from making poor decisions. I accept that it's only a certain part of the market in which participating adults are not mentally intelligent enough to make informed decisions. You (apparently) accept that only a small part of marketing (dolls) to children is a problem (though rayiner seems to be totally against marketing to children altogether -- and it was to that point that my original reply was to). It would seem that we two should agree on a conclusion: advertising for all needs to be re-thought fundamentally. Cut out sexism, racism, sexual appeals in ads, as well as the wide variety of carefully, psychologically constructed ads in adult market, and cut out advertising highly sexualized dolls. I want to make a note that only these sexualized dolls are problematic. If you have a daughter you know that girls just prefer dolls and other girly things in an innate way (I'm practically a daddy of two, and despite all my trying to get them hooked on cars, action heroes, computers, they just always opt for the dolls when given the choice). There's nothing wrong with girls having dolls of all sorts, just that they shouldn't be sexualized.

by selmnoo 13y ago

harryh 13y ago

Yes, if you're marketing something specifically targeted at people with an "eating disorder, drug addiction, depression, impulse control disorder, poor memory, etc." than you have moral considerations above and beyond products targeted at regular adults.

selmnoo 13y ago
That is a cop-out answer. Consider what's being advertised to people who have the aforementioned mental disorders: Eating disorder = fast foods of all sorts, Mcdonald's, KFC, Burger King, etc. ice cream, chips, candies. None of this is extremely "healthy". Conversely on the other side, in which people avoid food, there is diet pills, weight loss through questionable means, etc. Drug addiction = alcohol, tobacco (though there is less of this now) Depression, impulse control disorder, and poor memory are conditions that affect buying decisions on a wide array of things, sort of catch-all conditions. A lot of people have these disorders. But there's been no effort made to do anything about this, with respect to how advertisements affect these folk. I would also like to point out something about the power of the two types of things sold here -- things that are definitely bad for you (alcohol, unhealthy food, expensive toys (because they leave you with less money to buy good food)), and dolls. I think one can reasonably defend the point that things being marketed to adults with poor decision-making skills harm them more than little girls being shown advertisements of dolls or whatever.
- harryh 13y ago
  Toys are marketed to children and only children. Fast food (to pick your first example) is marketed to basically everyone not specifically to people that have eating disorders. But this isn't black & white. Many people do, in fact, have moral problems with the marketing techniques of the fast food/junk food industry despite that fact that most of their customers are fully capable adults. These people have made efforts to limit what they can do, and I think most reasonable people would at least agree that their proposals are worth considering. Finally, I'm not sure about your last point about "more harm." Doll marketing is a part of a very serious sexism we have in our country. Surely it's only a small part, but it's a very serious problem. It's hard to quantify these things to make comparisons.
  - selmnoo 13y ago
    Before we get farther into this, consider the results of the two. What's the worst that will happen if kids are being advertised toys? They'll ask their parents to buy them? Maybe buy them themselves? Okay. Maybe not a prudent choice, time is wasted, a little bit of money is wasted... but the trajectory of life is very rarely totally devastated because of this. This is unlikely to happen anyway, considering there are already safeguard measures set up in society to prevent things going wrong: kids can't buy Mature-rated game, they typically don't have money anyway... parents have to make decisions for them. Mentally challenged adults have very little, if any, resources and safeguards to save them from making poor decisions. I accept that it's only a certain part of the market in which participating adults are not mentally intelligent enough to make informed decisions. You (apparently) accept that only a small part of marketing (dolls) to children is a problem (though rayiner seems to be totally against marketing to children altogether -- and it was to that point that my original reply was to). It would seem that we two should agree on a conclusion: advertising for all needs to be re-thought fundamentally. Cut out sexism, racism, sexual appeals in ads, as well as the wide variety of carefully, psychologically constructed ads in adult market, and cut out advertising highly sexualized dolls. I want to make a note that only these sexualized dolls are problematic. If you have a daughter you know that girls just prefer dolls and other girly things in an innate way (I'm practically a daddy of two, and despite all my trying to get them hooked on cars, action heroes, computers, they just always opt for the dolls when given the choice). There's nothing wrong with girls having dolls of all sorts, just that they shouldn't be sexualized.