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Apple Reports Fourth Quarter Results
- IBM 13y agoInteresting that iPad sales were flat year over year. I would have thought it would have contracted without new iPads launched. Also the big increase in iPhone sales year over year jives with what Asymco has posted about Android peaking. The easy growth from feature phones being replaced by low-end Android devices is over.
- cstrat 13y agoI have a lot of Apple devices, and I am sure there are others out there like me who are stick using an original iPad 2. Those devices have not really needed an upgrade unless you wanted to move to the mini. My device is almost at its end, I have dropped it a bunch of times and the battery is struggling to last a 10 hour day at work (I dont use it a lot during the day, only really in meetings and on the run). There is probably a big fleet of iPad 2 users out there who are almost ready to upgrade when their device dies. I think Apple have done right by the consumer by making iOS 7 work on the iPad 2... they could have chased profits and limited iOS 7 to only the newer iPads...
- shock-value 13y agoIMO the retina screen is a big reason to upgrade from the 2 (and is the reason I waited for the 3rd gen model). I pretty much use my iPad exclusively for reading text of some format--web pages, text-based services like Facebook and Reddit, books, etc. (with the occasional YouTube or Netflix video thrown in)--and having that extra clarity as compared to the first two versions is crucial for me. It's now that I don't really feel any compelling reason to upgrade -- even with iOS7 the interface is plenty fast enough, and I don't use it for games so any increases in performance wouldn't really matter to me.
- cstrat 13y agoYeah I forgot that the retina was the big selling point. For me I didn't mind the screen the way it was - the battery life is great since the screen is average. So for people like you who have moved to the iPad 3 (or whatever its stupid name was) - you have another year or two before needing a replacement...
- mixmastamyk 13y agoI use mine for netflix primarily, no need for the retina.
- jusben1369 13y ago"I would have thought it would have contracted without new iPads launched." Say what? That product line is only 3 or 4 years old and it's already flat? That was very surprising to me and very disappointing. Isn't the iPad now the new iPod? Only that I think took 7 years or more before it went flat. Apple's now a growth company only based on one single product that comes in two flavors and the entire rest of the tech world is gunning to take that away from them.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- cecilpl 13y agoShares trading down 3% in AH.
- tedunangst 13y agoShares trading up 1% in AH.
- r00fus 13y agoAH trading is volatile and bollocks as a consistent market sentiment.
- alttag 13y agoMarkets are hammering AAPL. Down $15 (about 3%) after-hours. https://www.google.com/finance?q=aapl https://www.google.com/finance?q=aapl
- giarc 13y agoIs -3% really a "hammering"? I did 5 seconds of research and found Apple has closed with a >=2% loss 3x since July 25th. Sept 16 Sept 10 Sept 20 EDIT "5 second" was to emphasize I could be wrong, not to be a dick.
- john_b 13y ago+/-3% is a common benchmark for the market's definition of "big swing". There's nothing really formal about it, and it's a more accurate measure when applied to the market as a whole rather than individual stocks. For a company like AAPL which is famous for not providing a lot of detailed information to investors, it might not be a big swing. For a different company, say P&G, it might be a huge swing.
- bradly 13y agoActually, there is a formal measurement of a stocks volitiliy called it's beta. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta_(finance) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta_(finance)
- john_b 13y agoBeta is one of many measures of volatility. Since it's a normalized correlation between the stock's rate of return and that of the market, it only really has meaning in the context of a stock's performance over a long time or in relation to the market as a whole. A stock's performance post-earnings is about as market-independent as you can get, however.
- foobarqux 13y agoThe formal measurement of a stock's volatility is its volatility.
- KaoruAoiShiho 13y agoDamn net profit of 7.5billion is now lower than samsung's 8.13billion.
- recuter 13y agoKeep in mind that Apple doesn't make aircraft carriers or nuclear power plants.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- KaoruAoiShiho 13y agoNeither does Samsung Electronics.
- encoderer 13y agoAlso, a significant share of Apple's revenue (and profit) is in the Q4 holiday season. Far more so on a percentage basis than Samsung. So I'm not really sure what the OP was getting at? A more important comparison I think is margin.
- KaoruAoiShiho 13y agoApple used to kick Samsung's ass every quarter so I'm rather shocked to find the tables turned already.
- mladenkovacevic 13y agoSamsung Electronics is only a subsidiary of Samsung Group which makes all those things. Samsung Electronics profits were $9.6 but that includes TVs and their semiconductor division. The actual mobile division had $6.3 in profits (about 20% growth from same time last year).
- IBM 13y agoSamsung's profits are up mainly because of chips which makes sense when they're manufacturing Apple's chips (and Apple's iPhone sales are up significantly). Samsung's growth in high-end phone sales is slowing down. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-10-24/samsung-profit-surges-as-cheaper-handsets-team-with-chips.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-10-24/samsung-profit-surg...
- TrainedMonkey 13y agoI wonder what percentage of HN is invested in apple, compared to the rest of investing community. I wonder what sort of biases, deeper understanding of technology, and/or hype trains cause that difference to arise. And above all, I wonder if Apple can finally solve 5S supply problems and deliver a hit Christmas quarter.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- ChuckMcM 13y agoNo way to hide this: 2013: Revenue $37.5B, Profit $7.5B (20%) 2012: Revenue $36.0B, Profit $8.2B (22%) Loss of 2% net profit year over year. Just under a 5% drop per share on a diluted basis. So its becoming less profitable to be Apple which speaks to the margin pressure they are under from credible Android phones and tablets. I don't think the market expected that (or maybe they did, GOOG is trading over $1000 these days)
- pbreit 13y agoGood. I'd much rather see more sales and lower margins.
- downandout 13y agoLet's remember that everyone was anticipating the iPhone 5s for all but 10 days of the third quarter, which naturally slowed iPhone 5 sales. Then Apple almost instantly ran into supply constraints after its release. Because of these two factors, these results aren't that meaningful. 4th quarter results will give a far more meaningful picture of iOS's place in the current market.
- Kylekramer 13y agoAren't those pretty much the exact same conditions as last year's quarter? iPhone 5 release: September 21, 2012. iPhone 5s/5c: September 20, 2013. And both had supply issues at launch. It seems fair to compare the quarters and draw some tentative conclusions.
- jljljl 13y agoThis argument would explain slower sales or lower revenues, but I'm not sure this has much validity in explaining the lower net profit or gross profit margins. Lower gross profit margins are probably better explained by either downward pressure on prices or upward pressures on costs of manufacture. It can also be driven by changes in product mix (e.g., higher sales of the lower margin iPad Mini). It's not unreasonable to attribute this to greater competition from lower margin Android products.
- tlrobinson 13y ago
- sksk 13y agoCNBC's summary explains the negative reaction to the earnings: Apple posted better than expected earnings and revenue for its fourth-quarter on Monday, but shares still took a hit in after-hours trading. The tech giant posted $8.26 a share on $37.5 billion in revenue. The street estimated the company would post $7.96 a share on revenue of $36.93 billion. But investors were disappointed with guidance for gross margins. During the current quarter, the company expects gross margins of 36.5 percent to 37.5 percent, which missed forecasts of 37.9 percent. http://www.cnbc.com/id/101149511 http://www.cnbc.com/id/101149511
- ksk 13y agoAs someone who has to buy Apple devices for work, I'm hoping they get some pressure to drop their prices, especially on MBPros. My next one will probably cost a bomb since the new ones don't let you stick in third party ram - though the SSD is replacable (with considerable effort)
- Domenic_S 13y agoIs replacing the SSD more effort now? It took maybe 10 minutes on my 2009 MBP to replace the stock HDD with an SSD & yank the optical drive for a second hdd.
- MaysonL 13y agoYes: take a look at the iFixit teardown, and the following Q&A on their site: http://www.ifixit.com/Answers/View/147466/Can+I+upgrade+flash+SSD+for+new+MacBook+Pro+13+later http://www.ifixit.com/Answers/View/147466/Can+I+upgrade+flas...
- than 13y agoApple deferred nearly a billion dollars in revenue due to the switch to free software. http://techcrunch.com/2013/10/28/apple-says-future-versions-of-os-x-will-be-free-notes-900m-increase-in-costs-from-free-software/ http://techcrunch.com/2013/10/28/apple-says-future-versions-...
- eltondegeneres 13y agoFor a moment there I thought Apple was switching to FSF-endorsed free software and I was very confused. The cost of OS X is built into the hardware so it's not like future versions will be free as in freedom or free of cost.
- MaysonL 13y agoAnd next quarter will defer almost a billion more than they did last year.
- dingaling 13y agoI know that accounting types like to use 'deferred', but to be clear Apple abandoned profit from software. They did not defer it to a later date, they recategorised software development as a cost center.
- Touche 13y agoSounds like the iPhone 5C slight of hand didn't work[1]. It makes sense to me, its last-years-model with cheaper materials. There's no reason it should be more popular than last-years-model usually are, except for the extra marketing which in this case didn't seem to help much. http://www.valuewalk.com/2013/10/apple-inc-earnings-iphone-5c-activations/ http://www.valuewalk.com/2013/10/apple-inc-earnings-iphone-5...
- Shivetya 13y agoNext quarter should be very interesting. New iMacs are out, new iPads, and of course the new Mac Pro. So out of all quarters which tend to be Apple's weakest? Perhaps getting more predictable in releases softens earnings in certain quarters?
- ffrryuu 13y agoWell, that spaceship costs a lot.
- S_A_P 13y agoI think a lot of this is expected no? The mobile market is maturing, and they are making less profitable versions of their products. Its interesting to see how investors react to Microsoft and Apple who are both hugely profitable, and then some start ups(ahem, twitter, pinterest, snapchat) with no proven business model get huge valuations. I know that investors are trying to predict the market, but the second a hugely profitable company seems unfashionable(for lack of a better word) any slight variation in performance is panned in the press and the stock gets sold off.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- MWinther 13y agoI thought the history of Apples profit margins were interesting. What happened in Q3 2010 when it was last this low? http://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/gross_profit_margin http://ycharts.com/companies/AAPL/gross_profit_margin