4 ms·

I have mixed feelings about the fact that right off the bat it sledgehammers home the fact that programming is for everyone and not just white anglo saxon males

I have mixed feelings about the fact that right off the bat it sledgehammers home the fact that programming is for everyone and not just white anglo saxon males.

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
- catwell 13y ago
  This thread is so full of BS I shouldn't even bother commenting, but maybe you should just know that Kyle himself is openly gay...
- aphyr 13y ago
  Today I learned that I'm straight, Nancy Lynch is a man, and David Nolen is white. Diverse engineers are all around us. They just go unnoticed--in part, because we interact with usernames and papers instead of face to face.
  - ivanpierre 13y ago
    +1 :D
- theorique 13y ago
  He's just signaling that he has the right beliefs about the right issues, and is therefore a modern righteous dude. Perhaps we should create a compiler that works differently for men, women, members of visible minorities, gays/straights, transgendered folks and so forth. I'm sure this would be a great advance in computer science. But, more seriously, this is actually one of the great things about exact sciences - they are objective and completely fair. A compiler or a mathematical proof or the laws of physics can't be racist or sexist. Unfortunately, we can't say the same about the social systems surrounding these sciences - a university department or a corporation, or some of the individual members of these organizations, can, of course, have bias. I don't know that the solution is injecting social justice content into technical discussions. It's probably fine to have a social track at a technical conference, where people know what they are getting into. But in the context of a technical lesson, it seems like derailing off topic.
- lbarrow 13y ago
  Good job assuming that anyone who writes an introduction to Clojure is a straight white dude. As it turns out, you're completely wrong.
logjam 13y ago
That's nice. And I have completely unmixed feelings from reading you and the other genius commenters here and in the other thread about how you are somehow threatened by his simple encouragement of underrepresented minorities in a technical field. Unlike you I'll actually tell you what my feelings are about the entrenched misogyny, racism, and sexism tolerated by so many white anglo saxon males in the tech world: complete disgust and contempt.
- lectrick 13y ago
  I randomly returned to this conversation and boy are there a lot of assholes here who commented after I left. I think I'm more on your side now. I like to think I'm a nice guy, but there's clearly a lot to learn... and to teach to other guys.
- bpwalker 13y ago
  Unfortunately I don't have enough points to downvote this so I'll just have to speak up. > entrenched misogyny, racism, and sexism tolerated by so many white anglo saxon. During my 15 years, as a white anglo saxon male, working at 8 companies of various size across Canada I have never met a man who hates women. Over the last say 10 years I have always been the minority by race and have reported women 40% of the time. It would be nice to have more women in IT (yes please!), but the crap you just spewed must not represent all of IT around the world. I don't have an appreciation for the intro. I think it detracts from an otherwise great blog post. And I think it's ok for people to have mixed feelings about it too.
- vezzy-fnord 13y ago
  Putting a "simple encouragement" in a technical tutorial like that is at the very least a non sequitur and detracts from the reading experience. That's not to say educational material should be dry and without humor, but this is simply pure agenda.
  - nosefrog 13y ago
    And I fail to see anything out of order with the agenda, "encourage women to program".

I have mixed feelings about the fact that right off the bat it sledgehammers home the fact that programming is for everyone and not just white anglo saxon males.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

catwell 13y ago
This thread is so full of BS I shouldn't even bother commenting, but maybe you should just know that Kyle himself is openly gay...
aphyr 13y ago
Today I learned that I'm straight, Nancy Lynch is a man, and David Nolen is white. Diverse engineers are all around us. They just go unnoticed--in part, because we interact with usernames and papers instead of face to face.
- ivanpierre 13y ago
  +1 :D
theorique 13y ago
He's just signaling that he has the right beliefs about the right issues, and is therefore a modern righteous dude. Perhaps we should create a compiler that works differently for men, women, members of visible minorities, gays/straights, transgendered folks and so forth. I'm sure this would be a great advance in computer science. But, more seriously, this is actually one of the great things about exact sciences - they are objective and completely fair. A compiler or a mathematical proof or the laws of physics can't be racist or sexist. Unfortunately, we can't say the same about the social systems surrounding these sciences - a university department or a corporation, or some of the individual members of these organizations, can, of course, have bias. I don't know that the solution is injecting social justice content into technical discussions. It's probably fine to have a social track at a technical conference, where people know what they are getting into. But in the context of a technical lesson, it seems like derailing off topic.
lbarrow 13y ago
Good job assuming that anyone who writes an introduction to Clojure is a straight white dude. As it turns out, you're completely wrong.

logjam 13y ago

That's nice. And I have completely unmixed feelings from reading you and the other genius commenters here and in the other thread about how you are somehow threatened by his simple encouragement of underrepresented minorities in a technical field. Unlike you I'll actually tell you what my feelings are about the entrenched misogyny, racism, and sexism tolerated by so many white anglo saxon males in the tech world: complete disgust and contempt.

lectrick 13y ago
I randomly returned to this conversation and boy are there a lot of assholes here who commented after I left. I think I'm more on your side now. I like to think I'm a nice guy, but there's clearly a lot to learn... and to teach to other guys.
bpwalker 13y ago
Unfortunately I don't have enough points to downvote this so I'll just have to speak up. > entrenched misogyny, racism, and sexism tolerated by so many white anglo saxon. During my 15 years, as a white anglo saxon male, working at 8 companies of various size across Canada I have never met a man who hates women. Over the last say 10 years I have always been the minority by race and have reported women 40% of the time. It would be nice to have more women in IT (yes please!), but the crap you just spewed must not represent all of IT around the world. I don't have an appreciation for the intro. I think it detracts from an otherwise great blog post. And I think it's ok for people to have mixed feelings about it too.
vezzy-fnord 13y ago
Putting a "simple encouragement" in a technical tutorial like that is at the very least a non sequitur and detracts from the reading experience. That's not to say educational material should be dry and without humor, but this is simply pure agenda.
- nosefrog 13y ago
  And I fail to see anything out of order with the agenda, "encourage women to program".