3 ms·

Why is it relevant that it was a woman? It sounds like you suggest that the only applicant academia got was a 'woman', as if women are mediocre at best.

jjoonathan 13y ago
Just the opposite. We already know that she chose physics even though the prior of being a woman made that choice less likely. We can infer that she was probably more dedicated to the subject itself than her average peer. The fact that she eventually made it in academia supports this hypothesis. Another possibility is that she had a partner willing to support her if things went south. Obviously this situation isn't unique to women, but I do think it's slightly more probable for a woman to have such a partner. If this is the case, PaulHoule's point becomes that the decision to enter grad school only made sense for her because of the artificially reduced consequences of p(failure). Even if affirmative action did play a role (a recent paper found very damning, well-controlled evidence of systematic bias against women in the evaluation process, so I wouldn't assume this with any degree of certainty), PaulHoule could have simply been observing that she saw a better p(success) and was therefore the only one willing to take the leap. Or maybe PaulHoule is a misogynist. But I'd be willing to bet against you if you still thought that.
- louwrentius 13y ago
  I understand and you may be right. However, I almost got the impression that 79 students weren't as 'stupid' to enrol in Academia because of the prospects, only the 'women' was. But I'm probably reading tea leaves. Without context, the remark ' a women' is meaningless and almost suspicious. And I think that's my point.
judk 13y ago
Or that academia is less mysgonistic and more compatible with a woman's life trajectory than industry. No need to project your insecurities onto others.
- PaulHoule 13y ago
  It's probably more the other way around. A woman who wants to take two years off (about the time it takes to do a master's degree) to take care of their kids at home might need to jump off the corporate ladder a bit but they can hop back on. A key principle of academic life is "you never get a second chance" and this just isn't an option. I don't know how the woman involves feels about the matter, but I know of a male professor who put off having kids until his wife was infertile and he regrets that very much.

jjoonathan 13y ago

Just the opposite. We already know that she chose physics even though the prior of being a woman made that choice less likely. We can infer that she was probably more dedicated to the subject itself than her average peer. The fact that she eventually made it in academia supports this hypothesis. Another possibility is that she had a partner willing to support her if things went south. Obviously this situation isn't unique to women, but I do think it's slightly more probable for a woman to have such a partner. If this is the case, PaulHoule's point becomes that the decision to enter grad school only made sense for her because of the artificially reduced consequences of p(failure). Even if affirmative action did play a role (a recent paper found very damning, well-controlled evidence of systematic bias against women in the evaluation process, so I wouldn't assume this with any degree of certainty), PaulHoule could have simply been observing that she saw a better p(success) and was therefore the only one willing to take the leap. Or maybe PaulHoule is a misogynist. But I'd be willing to bet against you if you still thought that.

louwrentius 13y ago
I understand and you may be right. However, I almost got the impression that 79 students weren't as 'stupid' to enrol in Academia because of the prospects, only the 'women' was. But I'm probably reading tea leaves. Without context, the remark ' a women' is meaningless and almost suspicious. And I think that's my point.

judk 13y ago

Or that academia is less mysgonistic and more compatible with a woman's life trajectory than industry. No need to project your insecurities onto others.

PaulHoule 13y ago
It's probably more the other way around. A woman who wants to take two years off (about the time it takes to do a master's degree) to take care of their kids at home might need to jump off the corporate ladder a bit but they can hop back on. A key principle of academic life is "you never get a second chance" and this just isn't an option. I don't know how the woman involves feels about the matter, but I know of a male professor who put off having kids until his wife was infertile and he regrets that very much.