4 ms·

So, because of this article you conclude that the OP is wrong to say poor people are "unable to make enough money to feed themselves and their families working

by smtddr 13y ago

So, because of this article you conclude that the OP is wrong to say poor people are "unable to make enough money to feed themselves and their families working multiple part-time/full-time jobs paying these sorts of wages."? Maybe they spend less because they simply can't afford to spend more? I spend less on private-jets & high-end cars than rich people do, is it because I simply don't want those items or because I can't afford it? Actually, this article appears to be saying the opposite of what you think it's saying: FTA: The short answer is that relative food costs are low and falling fast for everybody -- but they're not falling for the poor. In 1984, the poorest Americans spent 16 percent of their income to eat. The median-income family also spent 16 percent of its (slightly higher) income on food. And the rich spent the least. In the last three decades, food's share of the family budget has fallen for all but the poorest families, where it's stayed the same. So... poor people are spending _more_ on food than the rich? Whatever way one interprets this article, I don't think it can be used to to prove anything in regards to affordability of food for the poor and what else they may have sacrificed to pay for food.

qwerty989 13y ago
Yes, he is wrong. The poor in America are far likelier to be overweight than starving.
- smtddr 13y ago
  Ah, here we go. So overweight because why? Eating 99-cent menu items from fast-food menus 4 times a day and filling their homes with the cheapest industrial-processed food ever. Liters of soda, microwave-TV-dinners, huge bags of cheetos, etc. That junk isn't food, IMHO. If a low-income person wants to give their family something better, they can't afford it. Low-income, probably low-education & stressful-job(s), not enough motivation/energy after coming home from work to cook a proper meal or get exercise. Personally, I think they can't afford it in ways that go beyond just money...
  - qwerty989 13y ago
    This is so wrong. I'm not sure why this argument is always made when it's obviously incorrect. Beans, rice, cabbage, tomatoes, chicken, pasta, bread, potatoes, bananas, yogurt, eggs, vegetables, etc. are cheap. http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/cheap-healthy-15-nutritious-foods-about-2-dollars http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/cheap-healthy-15-... http://www.workingmother.com/food-nutrition/cheap-and-healthy-eating-tips http://www.workingmother.com/food-nutrition/cheap-and-health... http://www.fitbie.com/slideshow/20-ridiculously-cheap-and-healthy-foods http://www.fitbie.com/slideshow/20-ridiculously-cheap-and-he...
    - smtddr 13y ago
      Don't forget the last part of my comment: Low-income, probably low-education & stressful-job(s), not enough motivation/energy after coming home from work to cook a proper meal or get exercise. Personally, I think they can't afford it in ways that go beyond just money... _____ways that go beyond money____ stressful-job(s) = not enough motivation/energy to cook. Multiple jobs probably means get home, just in time to take a 3 hour nap, take shower and head out to the next job. Forget about any meaningful attendance at the local gym. Assuming it's even safe enough to be at said gym during after-work hours in a low-income area. low education = Not knowing just how damaging junk food really is.
      - qwerty989 13y ago
        Again, that is not correct. Despite conventional wisdom, the poor have more leisure time than the rich. http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/everyday_economics/2007/03/the_theory_of_the_leisure_class.html http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/everyday_economics/2007/0...
        smtddr 13y ago
        Okay, I'm done here. I'm not even clicking on that link. Go tell that to the illegal immigrants doing back-breaking labor everyday, poor people barely making ends meet with their 2 or 3 jobs, that they have more quality leisure time than high-level executives in some financial company, a Bay Area software engineer making nearly 6-figures or rich celebrities who took their daughter, and all her friends to Paris for her sweet 16 birthday-party, bought her a car and had Justin Timerlake perform live with a song written just for her.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Super_Sweet_16 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Super_Sweet_16
- andyjohnson0 13y ago
  "The poor in America are far likelier to be overweight than starving." Your statement is true, but mainly because very few people in the US are actually starving. What they are doing is living on poor diets. There certainly seems to be some kind of correlation between low income on obesity, but the contributing factors are complex. Individuals and families living on low incomes may lack ready access to fresh food ("food deserts") due to high transport costs and/or there being no nearby shops that sell it, may not have equipment to prepare food, may live in areas where opportunities for exercise are limited due to crime or lack of facilities. Poor education about nutrition and lack of role modes can also be important factors. I'd urge you to read the short article "Poverty and Obesity in the U.S." [1] from the American Diabetes Association. Quote: "How is poverty linked to obesity? It has been suggested that individuals who live in impoverished regions have poor access to fresh food. Poverty-dense areas are oftentimes called “food deserts,” implying diminished access to fresh food (7). However, 43% of households with incomes below the poverty line ($21,756) are food insecure (uncertain of having, or unable to acquire, sufficient food) (7). Accordingly, 14% of U.S. counties have more than 1 in 5 individuals use the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program. The county-wide utility of the program, as expected, correlates with county-wide poverty rates (r = 0.81) (7). Thus, in many poverty-dense regions, people are in hunger and unable to access affordable healthy food, even when funds avail. The double-edged sword of hunger and poor availability of healthy food is, however, unlikely to be the only reason as to why obesity tracks with poverty." The American Society for Clinical Nutrition has a paper from 2004 titled "Poverty and obesity: the role of energy density and energy costs" [2] that goes into a lot more detail. From the abstract: "A reduction in diet costs in linear programming models leads to high-fat, energy-dense diets that are similar in composition to those consumed by low-income groups. Such diets are more affordable than are prudent diets based on lean meats, fish, fresh vegetables, and fruit. The association between poverty and obesity may be mediated, in part, by the low cost of energy-dense foods and may be reinforced by the high palatability of sugar and fat. This economic framework provides an explanation for the observed links between socioeconomic variables and obesity when taste, dietary energy density, and diet costs are used as intervening variables." I would urge you to look into this subject more carefully and, considering some of your other comments in this thread, to avoid resorting to crude and misleading stereotypes of people living in poverty. [1] http://diabetes.diabetesjournals.org/content/60/11/2667.full http://diabetes.diabetesjournals.org/content/60/11/2667.full [2] http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/79/1/6.full http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/79/1/6.full

by smtddr 13y ago

qwerty989 13y ago

Yes, he is wrong. The poor in America are far likelier to be overweight than starving.

smtddr 13y ago
Ah, here we go. So overweight because why? Eating 99-cent menu items from fast-food menus 4 times a day and filling their homes with the cheapest industrial-processed food ever. Liters of soda, microwave-TV-dinners, huge bags of cheetos, etc. That junk isn't food, IMHO. If a low-income person wants to give their family something better, they can't afford it. Low-income, probably low-education & stressful-job(s), not enough motivation/energy after coming home from work to cook a proper meal or get exercise. Personally, I think they can't afford it in ways that go beyond just money...
- qwerty989 13y ago
  This is so wrong. I'm not sure why this argument is always made when it's obviously incorrect. Beans, rice, cabbage, tomatoes, chicken, pasta, bread, potatoes, bananas, yogurt, eggs, vegetables, etc. are cheap. http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/cheap-healthy-15-nutritious-foods-about-2-dollars http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/features/cheap-healthy-15-... http://www.workingmother.com/food-nutrition/cheap-and-healthy-eating-tips http://www.workingmother.com/food-nutrition/cheap-and-health... http://www.fitbie.com/slideshow/20-ridiculously-cheap-and-healthy-foods http://www.fitbie.com/slideshow/20-ridiculously-cheap-and-he...
  - smtddr 13y ago
    Don't forget the last part of my comment: Low-income, probably low-education & stressful-job(s), not enough motivation/energy after coming home from work to cook a proper meal or get exercise. Personally, I think they can't afford it in ways that go beyond just money... _____ways that go beyond money____ stressful-job(s) = not enough motivation/energy to cook. Multiple jobs probably means get home, just in time to take a 3 hour nap, take shower and head out to the next job. Forget about any meaningful attendance at the local gym. Assuming it's even safe enough to be at said gym during after-work hours in a low-income area. low education = Not knowing just how damaging junk food really is.
    - qwerty989 13y ago
      Again, that is not correct. Despite conventional wisdom, the poor have more leisure time than the rich. http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/everyday_economics/2007/03/the_theory_of_the_leisure_class.html http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/everyday_economics/2007/0...
      - smtddr 13y ago
        Okay, I'm done here. I'm not even clicking on that link. Go tell that to the illegal immigrants doing back-breaking labor everyday, poor people barely making ends meet with their 2 or 3 jobs, that they have more quality leisure time than high-level executives in some financial company, a Bay Area software engineer making nearly 6-figures or rich celebrities who took their daughter, and all her friends to Paris for her sweet 16 birthday-party, bought her a car and had Justin Timerlake perform live with a song written just for her.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Super_Sweet_16 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Super_Sweet_16
andyjohnson0 13y ago
"The poor in America are far likelier to be overweight than starving." Your statement is true, but mainly because very few people in the US are actually starving. What they are doing is living on poor diets. There certainly seems to be some kind of correlation between low income on obesity, but the contributing factors are complex. Individuals and families living on low incomes may lack ready access to fresh food ("food deserts") due to high transport costs and/or there being no nearby shops that sell it, may not have equipment to prepare food, may live in areas where opportunities for exercise are limited due to crime or lack of facilities. Poor education about nutrition and lack of role modes can also be important factors. I'd urge you to read the short article "Poverty and Obesity in the U.S." [1] from the American Diabetes Association. Quote: "How is poverty linked to obesity? It has been suggested that individuals who live in impoverished regions have poor access to fresh food. Poverty-dense areas are oftentimes called “food deserts,” implying diminished access to fresh food (7). However, 43% of households with incomes below the poverty line ($21,756) are food insecure (uncertain of having, or unable to acquire, sufficient food) (7). Accordingly, 14% of U.S. counties have more than 1 in 5 individuals use the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program. The county-wide utility of the program, as expected, correlates with county-wide poverty rates (r = 0.81) (7). Thus, in many poverty-dense regions, people are in hunger and unable to access affordable healthy food, even when funds avail. The double-edged sword of hunger and poor availability of healthy food is, however, unlikely to be the only reason as to why obesity tracks with poverty." The American Society for Clinical Nutrition has a paper from 2004 titled "Poverty and obesity: the role of energy density and energy costs" [2] that goes into a lot more detail. From the abstract: "A reduction in diet costs in linear programming models leads to high-fat, energy-dense diets that are similar in composition to those consumed by low-income groups. Such diets are more affordable than are prudent diets based on lean meats, fish, fresh vegetables, and fruit. The association between poverty and obesity may be mediated, in part, by the low cost of energy-dense foods and may be reinforced by the high palatability of sugar and fat. This economic framework provides an explanation for the observed links between socioeconomic variables and obesity when taste, dietary energy density, and diet costs are used as intervening variables." I would urge you to look into this subject more carefully and, considering some of your other comments in this thread, to avoid resorting to crude and misleading stereotypes of people living in poverty. [1] http://diabetes.diabetesjournals.org/content/60/11/2667.full http://diabetes.diabetesjournals.org/content/60/11/2667.full [2] http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/79/1/6.full http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/79/1/6.full