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Why oh why would they skimp on the extra $30 for 8GB of RAM? I have no idea how we got to the point where you need 4GB of RAM just to comfortably use a system,

Why oh why would they skimp on the extra $30 for 8GB of RAM? I have no idea how we got to the point where you need 4GB of RAM just to comfortably use a system, but looking at the memory consumption of Chrome gives a clear indication where we are heading.

shrughes_tmp1 13y ago
Obviously so they can charge $100 for it. Is this confusing?
Ruska 13y ago
Especially when you consider the fact that it's impossible to upgrade the RAM. Sure, many users are fine with 4GB now. However, many users that want a laptop that will satisfy their needs for several years will be frustrated to learn that their machine can't be upgraded.
- caw 13y ago
  Doesn't the new OS have memory compression so that you can run more apps with the same amount of memory?
  - cookiecaper 13y ago
    Memory compression is an overblown feature. It's definitely cool, but it's a band-aid. We've had it on Linux for 3+ years now and the place where its found the most use is Android; that is, embedded systems that are difficult to upgrade trying to squeeze just enough RAM for one or two more applications. In real life, memory compression is demanding on the CPU and they have to use a lightweight compression algorithm to keep response times snappy. It'll help sometimes, but in general, it's not going to make a machine with 4GB behave like a machine with 8. It might make it behave more like a somewhat-slower machine with 5.
- cookiecaper 13y ago
  Hasn't been a problem for Apple thus far. Their fanbase seems totally content to just throw the whole thing out every 3-5 years and buy a new one.
  - AYBABTME 13y ago
    I think that's true for all the market, not particular to Mac. I don't think most people usually keep their computers for more than 2-5 years.
    - cookiecaper 13y ago
      You're right that some PC brands also have high turnover, but remember that people are buying those PCs for $300-$500. Most people who invest $2k+ in computers keep those machines around for a while; even if their high-end usefulness has expired by year 5, there're lots of medium-end and low-end applications that can continue to be used on high-quality hardware.
  - Ruska 13y ago
    It's still kind of new for a lot of products. Macbook Pros that were released before the Retina MBP (16 months ago) could be upgraded.
mayhew 13y ago
Because they can charge us $100 for it.
masklinn 13y ago
FWIW there are strong and persistent report that OSX's memory management has finally stopped sucking in Mavericks, on top of the memory compression feature. A few people have reported significant improvements in "free" memory, and much more limited swapping due to e.g. the file cache being garbage[0]. So 4GB might be enough under Mavericks (BD obviously). The reason they do it is "free money" though, especially since memory is soldered. [0] http://www.reddit.com/r/osx/comments/1ov3jy/i_am_incredibly_impressed_with_the_mavericks/ccvxi5p http://www.reddit.com/r/osx/comments/1ov3jy/i_am_incredibly_...
gojomo 13y ago
My understanding is that more RAM is a noticeable drain on battery life, if you don't need it... so making a (profitable, optional) upgrade for power-users keeps the baseline battery-life numbers and satisfaction higher for normals.
jotm 13y ago
4GB of RAM is really a travesty on these laptops, 8GB should be minimum :-)...

shrughes_tmp1 13y ago

Obviously so they can charge $100 for it. Is this confusing?

Ruska 13y ago

Especially when you consider the fact that it's impossible to upgrade the RAM. Sure, many users are fine with 4GB now. However, many users that want a laptop that will satisfy their needs for several years will be frustrated to learn that their machine can't be upgraded.

caw 13y ago
Doesn't the new OS have memory compression so that you can run more apps with the same amount of memory?
- cookiecaper 13y ago
  Memory compression is an overblown feature. It's definitely cool, but it's a band-aid. We've had it on Linux for 3+ years now and the place where its found the most use is Android; that is, embedded systems that are difficult to upgrade trying to squeeze just enough RAM for one or two more applications. In real life, memory compression is demanding on the CPU and they have to use a lightweight compression algorithm to keep response times snappy. It'll help sometimes, but in general, it's not going to make a machine with 4GB behave like a machine with 8. It might make it behave more like a somewhat-slower machine with 5.
cookiecaper 13y ago
Hasn't been a problem for Apple thus far. Their fanbase seems totally content to just throw the whole thing out every 3-5 years and buy a new one.
- AYBABTME 13y ago
  I think that's true for all the market, not particular to Mac. I don't think most people usually keep their computers for more than 2-5 years.
  - cookiecaper 13y ago
    You're right that some PC brands also have high turnover, but remember that people are buying those PCs for $300-$500. Most people who invest $2k+ in computers keep those machines around for a while; even if their high-end usefulness has expired by year 5, there're lots of medium-end and low-end applications that can continue to be used on high-quality hardware.
- Ruska 13y ago
  It's still kind of new for a lot of products. Macbook Pros that were released before the Retina MBP (16 months ago) could be upgraded.

mayhew 13y ago

Because they can charge us $100 for it.

masklinn 13y ago

FWIW there are strong and persistent report that OSX's memory management has finally stopped sucking in Mavericks, on top of the memory compression feature. A few people have reported significant improvements in "free" memory, and much more limited swapping due to e.g. the file cache being garbage[0]. So 4GB might be enough under Mavericks (BD obviously). The reason they do it is "free money" though, especially since memory is soldered. [0] http://www.reddit.com/r/osx/comments/1ov3jy/i_am_incredibly_impressed_with_the_mavericks/ccvxi5p http://www.reddit.com/r/osx/comments/1ov3jy/i_am_incredibly_...

gojomo 13y ago

My understanding is that more RAM is a noticeable drain on battery life, if you don't need it... so making a (profitable, optional) upgrade for power-users keeps the baseline battery-life numbers and satisfaction higher for normals.

jotm 13y ago

4GB of RAM is really a travesty on these laptops, 8GB should be minimum :-)...