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This was interesting but the title "From China, With Love" seems descriptively weak and unnecessarily confrontational, as if somehow the Chinese government were

This was interesting but the title "From China, With Love" seems descriptively weak and unnecessarily confrontational, as if somehow the Chinese government were to blame for one router manufacturers backdoor.

tptacek 13y ago
* Chinese intervention and even ownership of its local industries is a well-known phenomenon. You can't on the one hand believe that NSA --- err, Clyde Frog --- is strongarming US Internet companies into complying with court orders while at the same time seriously suggesting that Chinese manufacturers are independent of the Chinese state. * How much do we know about Shenzhen Tenda? All I could find in 5 minutes or so of research is that it's the result of the efforts of D.P. Quan to provide networking and enrich the lives of all people through, IIRC, excellence. * China has a very well-established, well-attributed track record of attacking the tech infrastructure of the rest of the world, and does so through proxy organizations. * A very blatant backdoor with minimal tech support value is something that is more valuable to a state than to a random tech company.
- est 13y ago
  US gadgets have backdoor - blame the bad programmers Chinese gadgets have backdoor - evil Communist country making a grand scheme.
  - tptacek 13y ago
    Minus the "evil" and "communist" (that doesn't really describe China anymore), that sounds about right.
  - mintplant 13y ago
    Ever since the Snowden situation began every security issue related to the US has invited comments suggesting the NSA might be involved. I don't see your point.
- jotm 13y ago
  But the NSA (with the FBI) IS strongarming companies to comply with court orders :-)
- justincormack 13y ago
  Its not that useful as it is not accessible remotely. If I was the government I would ask for a better backdoor.
sounds 13y ago
The title is not really an interesting subject of discussion. After reading the article (ignoring the title), I find the author is neither descriptively weak or unnecessarily confrontational.
adestefan 13y ago
It's pretty well known that there is some terrible software that comes out of the Chinese hardware shops. 99.9% of the time these are not malicious back doors. Instead they're debugging or QA frameworks that just get left in released software. There is zero process or control of the releases. They can certainly put a system together, but they can't write the software for shit.
- joosters 13y ago
  Your comment is just another over-generalisation. You sum up the entire spectrum of Chinese companies with 'they'. Why do you think this makes sense and yet you'd naturally spot that it would be plain dumb to summarise and generalise American companies in this way?
  - adestefan 13y ago
    No. I generalized Chinese hardware shops. Not all Chinese companies. Having spent years working with software, and sometimes rewriting it, from said companies I'm perfectly content with the generalization I've made.

tptacek 13y ago

* Chinese intervention and even ownership of its local industries is a well-known phenomenon. You can't on the one hand believe that NSA --- err, Clyde Frog --- is strongarming US Internet companies into complying with court orders while at the same time seriously suggesting that Chinese manufacturers are independent of the Chinese state. * How much do we know about Shenzhen Tenda? All I could find in 5 minutes or so of research is that it's the result of the efforts of D.P. Quan to provide networking and enrich the lives of all people through, IIRC, excellence. * China has a very well-established, well-attributed track record of attacking the tech infrastructure of the rest of the world, and does so through proxy organizations. * A very blatant backdoor with minimal tech support value is something that is more valuable to a state than to a random tech company.

est 13y ago
US gadgets have backdoor - blame the bad programmers Chinese gadgets have backdoor - evil Communist country making a grand scheme.
- tptacek 13y ago
  Minus the "evil" and "communist" (that doesn't really describe China anymore), that sounds about right.
- mintplant 13y ago
  Ever since the Snowden situation began every security issue related to the US has invited comments suggesting the NSA might be involved. I don't see your point.
jotm 13y ago
But the NSA (with the FBI) IS strongarming companies to comply with court orders :-)
justincormack 13y ago
Its not that useful as it is not accessible remotely. If I was the government I would ask for a better backdoor.

sounds 13y ago

The title is not really an interesting subject of discussion. After reading the article (ignoring the title), I find the author is neither descriptively weak or unnecessarily confrontational.

adestefan 13y ago

It's pretty well known that there is some terrible software that comes out of the Chinese hardware shops. 99.9% of the time these are not malicious back doors. Instead they're debugging or QA frameworks that just get left in released software. There is zero process or control of the releases. They can certainly put a system together, but they can't write the software for shit.

joosters 13y ago
Your comment is just another over-generalisation. You sum up the entire spectrum of Chinese companies with 'they'. Why do you think this makes sense and yet you'd naturally spot that it would be plain dumb to summarise and generalise American companies in this way?
- adestefan 13y ago
  No. I generalized Chinese hardware shops. Not all Chinese companies. Having spent years working with software, and sometimes rewriting it, from said companies I'm perfectly content with the generalization I've made.