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While I agree with your "leave them alone" sentiment, why can't that apply to all animals/sentient beings? I'm not sure how to answer that question myself... b

by cko 13y ago

While I agree with your "leave them alone" sentiment, why can't that apply to all animals/sentient beings? I'm not sure how to answer that question myself... but a lot of comments thus far say something like "they are intelligent so leave them alone." On the other hand, if an animal is ugly or stupid or abundant, like spiders or cockroaches or deer or (I can't think of an example of a stupid animal) then it's okay to exterminate/hunt/harvest/kill them. I'm just curious what line of reasoning or criteria that lead to "dog: awesome, do not abuse! Michael Vick is a monster", "pig: edible", "spider: kill on sight", etc. Is it attractiveness? Perceived benefit to our own species?

tehwalrus 13y ago
I'm a vegetarian, and I also tend to get pests out of my house rather than kill them, where possible (including spiders.) So, I don't get your examples of hypocrisy; they're not acceptable just because everyone is doing them. I value living things because I'm a chronic Myers Briggs "Feeler" - I put myself in the other things' shoes way too much for my own good, including things like octopuses and pigs. It's much harder for insects because their neural circuitry is so much simpler, but I still try and avoid killing them needlessly.
- cko 13y ago
  I, too, consistently test as a "Feeler" when taking Myers-Briggs. Sometimes after it rains I go out side and scoop earthworms back into the grass so they don't dry up and die later. Then I wonder if I should be going to everyone's driveway and doing the same thing. Then again, I'm not strictly a vegetarian (I eat meat rarely). It's interesting to see how people reason these things - like, for example, at my job there are lots of dog-lovers, but they won't hesitate to kill an ant or spider.
  - tehwalrus 13y ago
    It's much more reasonable to kill a very very simple organism like an ant or spider than a mammal or cephalopod. You're right that the individual choices people make are interesting!
- girvo 13y ago
  I'm not a vegetarian, not in the slightest. But I don't kill "pests", I too remove them. I grew up on a farm, and have killed plenty of animals for food... But I don't see a reason to do so just because they're "annoying". Hell, I've called the RSPCA to deal with brown snakes instead of killing them, and they will kill you ten times over if they decide to. /Shrugs If it's not going to be eaten, and you're not about to die from it, then why kill any animal at all?
  - jlgreco 13y ago
    > brown snakes ... they will kill you ten times over if they decide to. You had me concerned there for a moment until I figured out that you weren't talking about the "brown snakes" that are in North America.
    - girvo 13y ago
      Australia, mate ;) Shrimp on the barbie, and all that. As a digression -- they're prawns. Not shrimps. Never got that.
socillion 13y ago
It may have more to do with anthropomorphizing than anything - it's much easier for an urban dweller to project human qualities onto animals like dogs, which they interact with frequently, than the slabs of pig meat they see in stores. A distaste for eating animals perceived to have more human-like qualities follows naturally from avoiding eating humans.

by cko 13y ago

tehwalrus 13y ago

I'm a vegetarian, and I also tend to get pests out of my house rather than kill them, where possible (including spiders.) So, I don't get your examples of hypocrisy; they're not acceptable just because everyone is doing them. I value living things because I'm a chronic Myers Briggs "Feeler" - I put myself in the other things' shoes way too much for my own good, including things like octopuses and pigs. It's much harder for insects because their neural circuitry is so much simpler, but I still try and avoid killing them needlessly.

cko 13y ago
I, too, consistently test as a "Feeler" when taking Myers-Briggs. Sometimes after it rains I go out side and scoop earthworms back into the grass so they don't dry up and die later. Then I wonder if I should be going to everyone's driveway and doing the same thing. Then again, I'm not strictly a vegetarian (I eat meat rarely). It's interesting to see how people reason these things - like, for example, at my job there are lots of dog-lovers, but they won't hesitate to kill an ant or spider.
- tehwalrus 13y ago
  It's much more reasonable to kill a very very simple organism like an ant or spider than a mammal or cephalopod. You're right that the individual choices people make are interesting!
girvo 13y ago
I'm not a vegetarian, not in the slightest. But I don't kill "pests", I too remove them. I grew up on a farm, and have killed plenty of animals for food... But I don't see a reason to do so just because they're "annoying". Hell, I've called the RSPCA to deal with brown snakes instead of killing them, and they will kill you ten times over if they decide to. /Shrugs If it's not going to be eaten, and you're not about to die from it, then why kill any animal at all?
- jlgreco 13y ago
  > brown snakes ... they will kill you ten times over if they decide to. You had me concerned there for a moment until I figured out that you weren't talking about the "brown snakes" that are in North America.
  - girvo 13y ago
    Australia, mate ;) Shrimp on the barbie, and all that. As a digression -- they're prawns. Not shrimps. Never got that.

socillion 13y ago

It may have more to do with anthropomorphizing than anything - it's much easier for an urban dweller to project human qualities onto animals like dogs, which they interact with frequently, than the slabs of pig meat they see in stores. A distaste for eating animals perceived to have more human-like qualities follows naturally from avoiding eating humans.