7 ms·
This article makes an interesting comparison between San Francisco and Seattle. "San Francisco has produced an average of 1,500 new housing units per year. Com
by geebee 13y ago
This article makes an interesting comparison between San Francisco and Seattle.
"San Francisco has produced an average of 1,500 new housing units per year. Compare this with Seattle (another 19th century industrial city that now has a tech economy), which has produced about 3,000 units per year over the same time period (and remember it's starting from a smaller overall population base). While Seattle decided to embrace infill development as a way to save open space at the edge of its region and put more people in neighborhoods where they could walk, San Francisco decided to push regional population growth somewhere else."
Interesting point, but are we comparing apples-to-apples? Here's the wikipedia page for Seattle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle
land area is 142 sq miles, current population density is 7,402/sq mi .
For San Francisco, we get:
https://www.google.com/#q=wikipedia+san+francisco https://www.google.com/#q=wikipedia+san+francisco
land area is 46.87 sq mi, population density is 17,620/sq mi.
Now, the article did mention "infill" which sounds more urban, so maybe there's a difference in the city and county of Seattle? I don't really know how that works up there. San Francisco is a very rare case where the city and county are the same. The article doesn't seem clear about this - how are we defining "Seattle" for the purposes of this article? If we cherry picked a 142 square mile area around SF, I think we could probably substantial construction and growth. In some ways, the article even goes on to mention this by talking about how SF and Oakland aren't part of the same city, but that this is where the growth is starting to happen.
SF is at the point where there isn't much left to be infilled. There certainly is some, but by and large, you'd have to tear something down to build something up - at least to a much larger extent than cities that get to be defined as a 150 square mile area or more.
I don't think there's much to be done here... but I think people are coming down pretty hard on SF. My guess is that you could easily circle 48 square miles of most major cities with comparable population density that haven't allowed much construction in the last 50 years or so, and you could easily circle 150 square miles around SF that make it look like it has pursued rapid growth policies. The difference is that because of the way borders work in the bay area, SF appears to be hostile to development because the new growth happens elsewhere.
- dragonwriter 13y ago> Now, the article did mention "infill" which sounds more urban, so maybe there's a difference in the city and county of Seattle? Seattle is in King County, which has a total area of 2,307 sq. mi. This is clearly referring to the city proper, which is, as you note, still much bigger than the City and County of SF, and much less densely populated to start with.
- baddox 13y agoThe land area and population density differences are huge, but they're not really relevant unless they are the physical bottlenecks for housing construction in SF, which I presume they are not. Politics (namely, zoning) seems to be SF's bottleneck.
- whyenot 13y agoYou can't do much "infill" development in SF while you still can in Seattle. That's very much a "physical bottleneck" that must be accounted for when comparing the two cities. In SF, if you want to build something, that means tearing something else down. In Seattle, there is still open space that can be built on. Of course politics plays a role, but lets not pretend that there aren't very real physical bottlenecks to building in SF.
- baddox 13y ago> Of course politics plays a role, but lets not pretend that there aren't very real physical bottlenecks to building in SF. There's a difference between "physical challenges" and "physical bottlenecks" to building in SF. Of course there are physical challenges. I'm claiming that the physical challenges are not the bottleneck, or in other words, if people were legally allowed to purchase property, tear down existing buildings if necessary, and build new taller buildings, I strongly suspect they would do so.
- mjn 13y agoThe amount of space impacts the politics as well, though. Seattle's new construction is largely converting ex-industrial zones to residential, not redeveloping existing residential zones, which is much easier to do politically. SF has had that kind of development too: much of SoMA is ex-industrial converted to residential. But there is not nearly as much ex-industrial land in SF compared to Seattle (or Oakland, for that matter).