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The story is heart wrenching, but the fact is, it may not be true. Anyone can literally say anything they want about someone and the internet will believe it wi

The story is heart wrenching, but the fact is, it may not be true. Anyone can literally say anything they want about someone and the internet will believe it without a moment's hesitation. It is downright scary. If you were the accused and the story was contrived, you would not have much recourse.

steveklabnik 13y ago
There are two men, one of whom stopped it, who corroborate her story: http://theotherzach.com/writes/2013/10/9/events http://theotherzach.com/writes/2013/10/9/events and http://blog.matt-darby.com/essays/i-am-the-other-developer http://blog.matt-darby.com/essays/i-am-the-other-developer
- kenster07 13y ago
  I appreciate that, and if the story is true, I hope the perpetrator suffers the consequences. But we are not the jury here, as fun as it may be. We should not try to ruin someone's life in such a fickle forum.
  - steveklabnik 13y ago
    Absolutely nothing about this is 'fun'.
    - i_am_dead 13y ago
      You sure seem to have a horse in this race
      - steveklabnik 13y ago
        Yes, I would prefer that the women in my community are not sexually assaulted. I absolutely have a horse in this race. Furthermore, I have been friends with Joe for years, and don't know Justine.
      - chris_wot 13y ago
        Yeah. He hates sexual assault.
    - lawnchair_larry 13y ago
      It's rather inappropriate for you and wilkie to be vilifying and linking to individual HN comments you disagree with on twitter. That's poor etiquette and not having a discussion in good faith. Don't pretend you're civil here and then talk behind people's backs in another public venue. Grow up.
- exodust 13y ago
  Interesting. She actually lay on the bar AFTER he had his hand on her butt. That's a bit different to her account. Also, she failed to mention the "chomping on her breast". Silly girl.
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
    - sneak 13y ago
      Hey, ally: try educating instead of ad hominem. It works better.
      - steveklabnik 13y ago
        Yeah, I know. :( Should take some time off.
        britta 13y ago
        Thanks for making an effort in this thread, to both you and sneak (and others). It takes so much energy.
  - sneak 13y ago
    No action taken by a person entitles others to sexually assault them. There is no such thing as "advance consent". Please stop perpetuating this poisonous meme.
    - chris_wot 13y ago
      Thank you. I concur fully!!!
    - exodust 13y ago
      I like your quote, but isn't laughing a signal? And therefore an action? When you laugh after someone touches you (which apparently she did), you're communicating a thumbs up to the toucher. Which is NOT an invitation for more touching, I get that, but it's certainly within the rights of the toucher to believe that further touching has been pre-approved. Level of drunkness influences how someone will wait for a more certain invitation before going ahead and touching again. This happens sometimes in bars and clubs. She did say she felt suicidal at one point, so that's enough to lay off and put this down to just how far a messy night can go! We'll never know if another catalyst could have triggered suicidal thoughts if the event had never happened, but if I had to bet, I think she was heading somewhere dark before that night.
- Dalkore 13y ago
  Hardly. Matt Darby clearly describes a situation that there was ample time for her to walk away. AND I QUOTE (Darby's Account): "At first it was a hug, or an arm around the shoulders; friendly, drunken comraderie that they both were engaged in. Friends. Joe started to get a little more familiar and was running his hand down her back and patting at her butt (she was seated). I noticed, and I watched. It was getting creepy, but Justine didn't move, or slap him. She was laughing, I figured it was nothing huge. This continued for a few moments, then Justine got up on the bar, laid down in front of him, and the bartender poured a shot into her navel area. Joe slurped it up, then kissed her up the stomach until he got to, and chomped down, on her shirt-covered left breast. I was standing two feet away. I don't know who's idea this was. Justine sat down, and Joe picked up the pace. He was really rubbing on her, and it got to the point where I felt uncomfortable for both of them. This lasted for about two minutes. His hands were admittedly all over her. I was talking with Zach and Mike Eaton, who had just come over to us, and I said "I'll be right back" and walked over to diffuse the situation." There was plenty of time for her to make up any excuse to leave the situation.

steveklabnik 13y ago

There are two men, one of whom stopped it, who corroborate her story: http://theotherzach.com/writes/2013/10/9/events http://theotherzach.com/writes/2013/10/9/events and http://blog.matt-darby.com/essays/i-am-the-other-developer http://blog.matt-darby.com/essays/i-am-the-other-developer

kenster07 13y ago
I appreciate that, and if the story is true, I hope the perpetrator suffers the consequences. But we are not the jury here, as fun as it may be. We should not try to ruin someone's life in such a fickle forum.
- steveklabnik 13y ago
  Absolutely nothing about this is 'fun'.
  - i_am_dead 13y ago
    You sure seem to have a horse in this race
    - steveklabnik 13y ago
      Yes, I would prefer that the women in my community are not sexually assaulted. I absolutely have a horse in this race. Furthermore, I have been friends with Joe for years, and don't know Justine.
    - chris_wot 13y ago
      Yeah. He hates sexual assault.
  - lawnchair_larry 13y ago
    It's rather inappropriate for you and wilkie to be vilifying and linking to individual HN comments you disagree with on twitter. That's poor etiquette and not having a discussion in good faith. Don't pretend you're civil here and then talk behind people's backs in another public venue. Grow up.
exodust 13y ago
Interesting. She actually lay on the bar AFTER he had his hand on her butt. That's a bit different to her account. Also, she failed to mention the "chomping on her breast". Silly girl.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
  - sneak 13y ago
    Hey, ally: try educating instead of ad hominem. It works better.
    - steveklabnik 13y ago
      Yeah, I know. :( Should take some time off.
      - britta 13y ago
        Thanks for making an effort in this thread, to both you and sneak (and others). It takes so much energy.
- sneak 13y ago
  No action taken by a person entitles others to sexually assault them. There is no such thing as "advance consent". Please stop perpetuating this poisonous meme.
  - chris_wot 13y ago
    Thank you. I concur fully!!!
  - exodust 13y ago
    I like your quote, but isn't laughing a signal? And therefore an action? When you laugh after someone touches you (which apparently she did), you're communicating a thumbs up to the toucher. Which is NOT an invitation for more touching, I get that, but it's certainly within the rights of the toucher to believe that further touching has been pre-approved. Level of drunkness influences how someone will wait for a more certain invitation before going ahead and touching again. This happens sometimes in bars and clubs. She did say she felt suicidal at one point, so that's enough to lay off and put this down to just how far a messy night can go! We'll never know if another catalyst could have triggered suicidal thoughts if the event had never happened, but if I had to bet, I think she was heading somewhere dark before that night.
Dalkore 13y ago
Hardly. Matt Darby clearly describes a situation that there was ample time for her to walk away. AND I QUOTE (Darby's Account): "At first it was a hug, or an arm around the shoulders; friendly, drunken comraderie that they both were engaged in. Friends. Joe started to get a little more familiar and was running his hand down her back and patting at her butt (she was seated). I noticed, and I watched. It was getting creepy, but Justine didn't move, or slap him. She was laughing, I figured it was nothing huge. This continued for a few moments, then Justine got up on the bar, laid down in front of him, and the bartender poured a shot into her navel area. Joe slurped it up, then kissed her up the stomach until he got to, and chomped down, on her shirt-covered left breast. I was standing two feet away. I don't know who's idea this was. Justine sat down, and Joe picked up the pace. He was really rubbing on her, and it got to the point where I felt uncomfortable for both of them. This lasted for about two minutes. His hands were admittedly all over her. I was talking with Zach and Mike Eaton, who had just come over to us, and I said "I'll be right back" and walked over to diffuse the situation." There was plenty of time for her to make up any excuse to leave the situation.