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> Corporal punishment would have to be pretty awful to be more brutal, humiliating, violent, or vindictive than prison. Would have? Not really. Vindictive? Wha

by lake99 13y ago

> Corporal punishment would have to be pretty awful to be more brutal, humiliating, violent, or vindictive than prison. Would have? Not really. Vindictive? What exactly do you intend to achieve by putting someone in prison? Revenge? The fact that these things happen suggests that there is a problem with how prisons are run now. Full CCTV surveillance of prisons (including toilets) should solve the problem of rape. If I were ever in prison, I'm sure I wouldn't mind a camera watch me pinch a loaf, if it meant it's going to keep me safe from assaults. Even now, the offenders could be chemically castrated. In any case, these problems arise because prisons prefer to treat prisoners as animals, rather than work on rehab.

vidarh 13y ago
> In any case, these problems arise because prisons prefer to treat prisoners as animals, rather than work on rehab. Yet you suggest, as a solution, to treat them even more so: Subject them to full surveillance like at a zoo, and chemically castrate them.
- lake99 13y ago
  There was no "them" when I thought about it. I wrote about what I would prefer for myself. Do you want a humane solution? Ask the people affected what they would prefer. And chemical castration does little permanent harm. Yes, long-term use could reduce bone density, but a few months of the drug, and the offenders might change their mind about whether rape is worth the trouble or not.
  - vidarh 13y ago
    But the problem is not just in the cell where it just you, but amongst the general population. You are no safer if others opt for no CCTV and no castration, so you would be safer in your cell, and safe against becoming a rapist, but not much safer against being raped overall.
    - lake99 13y ago
      > But the problem is amongst the general population Do you imagine a scenario where I'd be the only guy getting assaulted? Must be an exceptionally safe prison then! Otherwise, I'm sure I could convince my fellow assault-victim inmates, and we could come up with an amicable solution. It's easy to pick on my ideas. I have never been in prison. I don't know feasible alternatives. I can't come up with solutions that please everybody. I already told you what I'd prefer if I were there. Why don't you propose your own solutions, instead of just nit-picking mine?
  - DanBC 13y ago
    > And chemical castration does little permanent harm. Turing. > but a few months of the drug, and the offenders might change their mind about whether rape is worth the trouble or not. Or they may just turn to using bottles or broom handles.
    - lake99 13y ago
      > Turing. 2013. Modern medicine has progressed quite a bit. And please don't bring up fluoroquinolone when I say just "antibiotics". > Or they may just turn to using bottles or broom handles. Thanks. I can come up with maybes by myself.
enoch_r 13y ago
You may have misunderstood me. I wasn't talking about ideal prisons. I said that, in order to be more vindictive than prison (meaning, the prison system as it exists in the US today), corporal punishment would have to be pretty awful. In other words, our current system uses prison as a means of punishment and vengeance. I'm not saying that's a good thing; I'm just saying that corporal punishment has a very low bar to clear before we can say it's more humane than the awful status quo. (Yes, rape-free prisons would also be an improvement, and probably a more realistically achievable improvement, though I disagree with the methods you suggest.)
- lake99 13y ago
  I see your point. Though I've not made up my mind about corporal punishment (as a step forward), I am concerned that whip-happy policemen might abuse it just the way they abuse tasers now.

by lake99 13y ago

vidarh 13y ago

> In any case, these problems arise because prisons prefer to treat prisoners as animals, rather than work on rehab. Yet you suggest, as a solution, to treat them even more so: Subject them to full surveillance like at a zoo, and chemically castrate them.

lake99 13y ago
There was no "them" when I thought about it. I wrote about what I would prefer for myself. Do you want a humane solution? Ask the people affected what they would prefer. And chemical castration does little permanent harm. Yes, long-term use could reduce bone density, but a few months of the drug, and the offenders might change their mind about whether rape is worth the trouble or not.
- vidarh 13y ago
  But the problem is not just in the cell where it just you, but amongst the general population. You are no safer if others opt for no CCTV and no castration, so you would be safer in your cell, and safe against becoming a rapist, but not much safer against being raped overall.
  - lake99 13y ago
    > But the problem is amongst the general population Do you imagine a scenario where I'd be the only guy getting assaulted? Must be an exceptionally safe prison then! Otherwise, I'm sure I could convince my fellow assault-victim inmates, and we could come up with an amicable solution. It's easy to pick on my ideas. I have never been in prison. I don't know feasible alternatives. I can't come up with solutions that please everybody. I already told you what I'd prefer if I were there. Why don't you propose your own solutions, instead of just nit-picking mine?
- DanBC 13y ago
  > And chemical castration does little permanent harm. Turing. > but a few months of the drug, and the offenders might change their mind about whether rape is worth the trouble or not. Or they may just turn to using bottles or broom handles.
  - lake99 13y ago
    > Turing. 2013. Modern medicine has progressed quite a bit. And please don't bring up fluoroquinolone when I say just "antibiotics". > Or they may just turn to using bottles or broom handles. Thanks. I can come up with maybes by myself.

enoch_r 13y ago

You may have misunderstood me. I wasn't talking about ideal prisons. I said that, in order to be more vindictive than prison (meaning, the prison system as it exists in the US today), corporal punishment would have to be pretty awful. In other words, our current system uses prison as a means of punishment and vengeance. I'm not saying that's a good thing; I'm just saying that corporal punishment has a very low bar to clear before we can say it's more humane than the awful status quo. (Yes, rape-free prisons would also be an improvement, and probably a more realistically achievable improvement, though I disagree with the methods you suggest.)

lake99 13y ago
I see your point. Though I've not made up my mind about corporal punishment (as a step forward), I am concerned that whip-happy policemen might abuse it just the way they abuse tasers now.