7 ms·

Airbnb makes small admission on tax issue, saying its hosts should pay

45 points by yapcguy 13y ago

testdrive5 13y ago
Wow, even after you invest heavily initially to buy a house with your own hard-earned money, you are still supposed to pay the government a cut for renting it? What has this world turned into! Shouldn't YOU be the one who should decide how you spend YOUR money, for renting out YOUR property?
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
- afreak 13y ago
  By that logic there should be no property taxes and eminent domain should too be tossed out the window. While taxes suck, property should not be exempt from it otherwise we'll have much further unfair taxation system.
  - judk 13y ago
    Parent was sarcasm, which doesn't work in text.
    - wpietri 13y ago
      Was it? How can you tell? To me it looked like general-issue IGMFY rhetoric.
      - mikeash 13y ago
        Poe's Law strikes again.
- auctiontheory 13y ago
  Perhaps. Did you use any of the resources and infrastructure of the economy and society to earn that money? Did you in any way use or depend on the legal system? The financial system? The roads? Internet? Phones? The financial system? Law and order? Was your education in any way supported by public funds? If you can answer no to every question, is the same also true for all of your paying customers?
  - auctiontheory 13y ago
    Oops. I must have "the financial system" on my brain tonight.
  - MAGZine 13y ago
    So when are we going to pay taxes for writing OSS? I mean, it was either taught to us by government-subsidized education, or we learnt it from the internet which is also government subsidized. The licenses which you license your software under are a product of the legal climate, generated by the legal system, etc etc etc. Look, all of this is ridiculous. I'm all for taxing business, but honestly, taxes on the house (the structure itself, the materials) have been long paid, and property taxes are being paid. If anything, I'd think that this would be a zoning issue, which would be handled by municipalities. But even then, I tend to agree that unless if your neighbors are taking issue with it, then taxes/fees should be kept at an absolute minimum, if not zero. e: on top of that, the money which he used to buy his house (with tax) as well as pay the annual property tax is ITSELF taxed by income tax. How many levels of taxing are appropriate? Honestly.
    - Xylakant 13y ago
      > So when are we going to pay taxes for writing OSS? Yes, sure, absolutely, we already do. It's a percentage of what you earned writing said OSS. I sometimes get paid by clients to write code that later gets open sourced and yes, sure, I pay regular income tax on that. If you didn't earn any money, well then the government cut is zero USD, just as it is when you give your room away for free to strangers.
      - 13y ago
- bdcravens 13y ago
  Pretty sure Donald Trump and the Hiltons feel the same way.
nostromo 13y ago
People have been making short-term rentals on CraigsList for over a decade, yet nobody expects them to collect hotel taxes. To expect Airbnb research hotel laws and taxes in every country they operate in seems like an undue burden. In fact, it's such a burden, that I'm sure Airbnb will support it in a few years time as a way to raise the barriers to entry on their industry.
- freerobby 13y ago
  Why? Is it any different than Amazon having to research sales tax laws in every municipality it operates in?
  - learc83 13y ago
    They don't, only in states where they have a legal nexus until/unless the marketplace fairness act passes the house.
    - deleted 13y ago
      [deleted]
    - deleted 13y ago
      [deleted]
- badclient 13y ago
  Craigslist does not collect payment to facilitate the stay. They do not offer insurance and serve as mediator during disputes. They do not operate concierge services. They operate significantly less like a hotel than airbnb.
  - nostromo 13y ago
    Which is more "hotely" to you: 1) A place where you pay someone to stay overnight. 2) A website that helps people find and pay for #1.
    - 13y ago
eriksank 13y ago
With anonymous crypto-currencies thrown into the fray, the next version of AirBnB -- that is undoubtedly already somewhere in the making -- may be entirely off-limits to this kind local government requests. Anybody can see today already that it is "game over" on quite a few older forms of taxation. The internet has started treating money as just information and ,therefore, taxation as just a form of censorship. It will just begin to route around that too.
briandear 13y ago
TLDR; NYC and San Fran, we already pay enough of your bullshit taxes. Let's take an imaginary trip to New York City.. Fly on an airplane to LGA -- pay Federal Taxes on the ticket approaching 50%. Pay a TSA "fee," pay an "Airport Use Fee," Pay a car rental tax of often 20% on top of the state and local sales taxes. Plus a parking tax of over 19%. If you take a taxi instead, the city charges a $0.50 tax on any trip within NYC, plus sales tax is automatically contained within the fare itself. Plus the driver gets to pay city taxes on the income from that fare as well and gasoline taxes on the fuel used as well as the insanely expensive cost of the taxi medallion itself. We're not even at the hotel yet. Perhaps you find a cheaper ticket flying into Newark? Cool, pay a Port Authority $13 toll just for using the Holland tunnel, though you do get to save on the $0.50 city taxi surcharge. Once you're at the hotel, however you get there you get to pay the following: New York State Sales Tax, New York City Sales Tax, and New York State Hotel Unit Fee $1.50 per unit per day. I haven't even had a chance to buy a slice of pizza yet and already I've paid some entity or another a significant amount of money in taxes. That means that the my travel budget of x dollars is now reduced by y dollars, which means that is y dollars less that I have to spend on actually increasing economic activity within the city. Which means that the businesses I would have purchased from have y dollars in fewer sales which means that they will pay both less in sales taxes, but also less in personal and business income taxes. And since I'm getting less value from my total travel budget, the likelihood that I'll travel to NYC any more than necessary is far diminished, thus leading to a overall net loss for the city. If you notice, anytime there is anything innovative (Airbnb, Uber, etc) within a city, they always are angling for a way to tax it. Perhaps if those lunatics in city government (especially NYC and San Fran) realize that the reason their cities are so expensive is because of the cumulative effect of all of this nickel and diming. Want affordable housing for "normal" people in NYC? End rent control. There are people in 3 bedroom, nice apartments in Soho, paying $500 per month, and in the same exact building, market rents are $5500 per month because the landlord has to subsidize the loss on the $500 apartment. And now NYC is crying about losing their occupancy taxes on Airbnb? As a former NYC resident I would like to cry about seeing police officer's driving $90,000 cars off-duty and using their "Police Official Business" placards to avoid paying parking fees. When I worked at General Assembly, I would see high-end Jaguars and Cadillacs parked in front of our building on 23rd street with police placards. While our unemployed students would have to go downstairs every few hours to stuff yet more money into the meter. NYC and San Francisco -- you can go suck an egg when it comes to collecting an occupancy tax for Airbnb.

45 points by yapcguy 13y ago

Wow, even after you invest heavily initially to buy a house with your own hard-earned money, you are still supposed to pay the government a cut for renting it? What has this world turned into! Shouldn't YOU be the one who should decide how you spend YOUR money, for renting out YOUR property?

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
afreak 13y ago
By that logic there should be no property taxes and eminent domain should too be tossed out the window. While taxes suck, property should not be exempt from it otherwise we'll have much further unfair taxation system.
- judk 13y ago
  Parent was sarcasm, which doesn't work in text.
  - wpietri 13y ago
    Was it? How can you tell? To me it looked like general-issue IGMFY rhetoric.
    - mikeash 13y ago
      Poe's Law strikes again.
auctiontheory 13y ago
Perhaps. Did you use any of the resources and infrastructure of the economy and society to earn that money? Did you in any way use or depend on the legal system? The financial system? The roads? Internet? Phones? The financial system? Law and order? Was your education in any way supported by public funds? If you can answer no to every question, is the same also true for all of your paying customers?
- auctiontheory 13y ago
  Oops. I must have "the financial system" on my brain tonight.
- MAGZine 13y ago
  So when are we going to pay taxes for writing OSS? I mean, it was either taught to us by government-subsidized education, or we learnt it from the internet which is also government subsidized. The licenses which you license your software under are a product of the legal climate, generated by the legal system, etc etc etc. Look, all of this is ridiculous. I'm all for taxing business, but honestly, taxes on the house (the structure itself, the materials) have been long paid, and property taxes are being paid. If anything, I'd think that this would be a zoning issue, which would be handled by municipalities. But even then, I tend to agree that unless if your neighbors are taking issue with it, then taxes/fees should be kept at an absolute minimum, if not zero. e: on top of that, the money which he used to buy his house (with tax) as well as pay the annual property tax is ITSELF taxed by income tax. How many levels of taxing are appropriate? Honestly.
  - Xylakant 13y ago
    > So when are we going to pay taxes for writing OSS? Yes, sure, absolutely, we already do. It's a percentage of what you earned writing said OSS. I sometimes get paid by clients to write code that later gets open sourced and yes, sure, I pay regular income tax on that. If you didn't earn any money, well then the government cut is zero USD, just as it is when you give your room away for free to strangers.
    - 13y ago
bdcravens 13y ago
Pretty sure Donald Trump and the Hiltons feel the same way.

nostromo 13y ago

People have been making short-term rentals on CraigsList for over a decade, yet nobody expects them to collect hotel taxes. To expect Airbnb research hotel laws and taxes in every country they operate in seems like an undue burden. In fact, it's such a burden, that I'm sure Airbnb will support it in a few years time as a way to raise the barriers to entry on their industry.

freerobby 13y ago
Why? Is it any different than Amazon having to research sales tax laws in every municipality it operates in?
- learc83 13y ago
  They don't, only in states where they have a legal nexus until/unless the marketplace fairness act passes the house.
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
badclient 13y ago
Craigslist does not collect payment to facilitate the stay. They do not offer insurance and serve as mediator during disputes. They do not operate concierge services. They operate significantly less like a hotel than airbnb.
- nostromo 13y ago
  Which is more "hotely" to you: 1) A place where you pay someone to stay overnight. 2) A website that helps people find and pay for #1.
  - 13y ago

eriksank 13y ago

With anonymous crypto-currencies thrown into the fray, the next version of AirBnB -- that is undoubtedly already somewhere in the making -- may be entirely off-limits to this kind local government requests. Anybody can see today already that it is "game over" on quite a few older forms of taxation. The internet has started treating money as just information and ,therefore, taxation as just a form of censorship. It will just begin to route around that too.

briandear 13y ago

TLDR; NYC and San Fran, we already pay enough of your bullshit taxes. Let's take an imaginary trip to New York City.. Fly on an airplane to LGA -- pay Federal Taxes on the ticket approaching 50%. Pay a TSA "fee," pay an "Airport Use Fee," Pay a car rental tax of often 20% on top of the state and local sales taxes. Plus a parking tax of over 19%. If you take a taxi instead, the city charges a $0.50 tax on any trip within NYC, plus sales tax is automatically contained within the fare itself. Plus the driver gets to pay city taxes on the income from that fare as well and gasoline taxes on the fuel used as well as the insanely expensive cost of the taxi medallion itself. We're not even at the hotel yet. Perhaps you find a cheaper ticket flying into Newark? Cool, pay a Port Authority $13 toll just for using the Holland tunnel, though you do get to save on the $0.50 city taxi surcharge. Once you're at the hotel, however you get there you get to pay the following: New York State Sales Tax, New York City Sales Tax, and New York State Hotel Unit Fee $1.50 per unit per day. I haven't even had a chance to buy a slice of pizza yet and already I've paid some entity or another a significant amount of money in taxes. That means that the my travel budget of x dollars is now reduced by y dollars, which means that is y dollars less that I have to spend on actually increasing economic activity within the city. Which means that the businesses I would have purchased from have y dollars in fewer sales which means that they will pay both less in sales taxes, but also less in personal and business income taxes. And since I'm getting less value from my total travel budget, the likelihood that I'll travel to NYC any more than necessary is far diminished, thus leading to a overall net loss for the city. If you notice, anytime there is anything innovative (Airbnb, Uber, etc) within a city, they always are angling for a way to tax it. Perhaps if those lunatics in city government (especially NYC and San Fran) realize that the reason their cities are so expensive is because of the cumulative effect of all of this nickel and diming. Want affordable housing for "normal" people in NYC? End rent control. There are people in 3 bedroom, nice apartments in Soho, paying $500 per month, and in the same exact building, market rents are $5500 per month because the landlord has to subsidize the loss on the $500 apartment. And now NYC is crying about losing their occupancy taxes on Airbnb? As a former NYC resident I would like to cry about seeing police officer's driving $90,000 cars off-duty and using their "Police Official Business" placards to avoid paying parking fees. When I worked at General Assembly, I would see high-end Jaguars and Cadillacs parked in front of our building on 23rd street with police placards. While our unemployed students would have to go downstairs every few hours to stuff yet more money into the meter. NYC and San Francisco -- you can go suck an egg when it comes to collecting an occupancy tax for Airbnb.