7 ms·

It is quite ridiculous that in a very capitalist oriented society the consumers end up owning nothing. Not even the movies they payed to watch, or the smart-pho

by antocv 13y ago

It is quite ridiculous that in a very capitalist oriented society the consumers end up owning nothing. Not even the movies they payed to watch, or the smart-phones in their pockets are really their property. Well, "the intellectual property" which prevents me from selling a copy of movie or book I bought, seems to supersede private property. I miss the old days when my money could actually buy things and I could trade with the goods and services that I bought. Now they want to take ownership of my user agent, my browser, they want to impose their intellectual rights on it, instead of mine.

sudomal 13y ago
Movies are probably the most easily justifiable for DRM. They aren't the sorts of 'products' that people watch over and over again (unless they get a cult following). A single viewing of a movie reduces the value to a point where it may not be purchased. That's why distributors release them in as many stunted, protected, phases as possible - they want a return on their investment before it becomes relatively worthless.
- DanBC 13y ago
  > Movies are probably the most easily justifiable for DRM. They aren't the sorts of 'products' that people watch over and over again (unless they get a cult following). Children watch movies VERY MANY TIMES. They also manage to destroy the physical media. I'm not sure what the law is about making a backup of the disc (is backup exempted, or am I circumventing an effective copyright measure?) but morally I think it's okay to make a back up of a DVD. Having said that, I'm on my 3rd DVD of Despicable Me.
  - chris_wot 13y ago
    > Children watch movies VERY MANY TIMES. They also manage to destroy the physical media. 100% agreed and can personally attest to that!!
    - menubar 13y ago
      These kids are destroying property that does not belong to them. This is a felony punishable by prison time and hard labor. You'd better turn them in at the nearest police station before Hollywood finds out and sends their hired thugs after you.
      - chris_wot 13y ago
        Believe me, there are some days I'm sorely tempted!
      - aaronem 13y ago
        What? I mean, full marks for hyperbole, but even DIVX never tried to claim the buyer didn't own the physical medium. It's the ownership of the bits stored thereon that's under discussion.
  - PeterisP 13y ago
    Making backups as such is legal under general global copyright laws. In USA however, if a content seller makes it very difficult to make a backup, then distributing devices to circumvent that may be illegal under DMCA.
  - ensignavenger 13y ago
    Are they scratching the disks to cause the damage- or are they actually wearing the disks out??? (Just curious- I agree 100% that you should have the right to make a backup of a DVD in case it gets destroyed.
- stonith 13y ago
  I dislike DRM in all of its forms, and hope that Mozilla does take a stance against having it in FF, but I agree with this sentiment. I don't want to own a movie, I want to watch it. I don't want to own music, I want to listen to it. What I don't agree with is the assumption from content producers that DRM is particularly useful. If the content is displayed on a screen or played out speakers, DRM isn't going to work.
  - SeanDav 13y ago
    Except if you don't own it you may be told you can't watch the film with more than 2 friends or on Friday evenings or Christmas Eve. You may be told you cannot listen to your music if travelling to another country, or copy it to your new $10,000 hi-fi so you can really enjoy it.
- belorn 13y ago
  Media distributors have all the right to modify their works in any way they feel like. It is after all their property and they should enjoy the Property rights associated with it. If they want to encrypt it, scramble it, create CDs with strange sectors, they are completely free to do so. My hardware however is not theirs, it's mine. I should have the same property rights to my property as they should have to theirs. Goods that still are controlled by the manufacturer has thus been designed to infringe on my property rights after ownership has been transfered. It is wrong, and should be illegal. DRM is a technical design to corrupt property rights. The actual owner has none of the rights in "Bundle of rights"¹. One losses any of the control associated with property rights². It removes the concept of private property in ways we should never allow. It is simply a worse crime in history than eminent domain, mostly because everyone nowadays carries it in their pocket. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bundle_of_rights https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bundle_of_rights 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Property_rights https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Property_rights
  - antocv 13y ago
    Lets not forget the laws against reverse-engineering. Lets not forget that people were seriously wondering if "jail-breaking" their iPhones is illegal or not. Thats how far it has gone. Its a disgrace to anything that a democratic liberal society is. What is next, you are not allowed to run a certain program on your devices? Then it will be illegal to access certain web-sites with your devices. Then perhaps it will be illegal to have read a text on a print-out. Watch out, citizen, what you are writing is illegal, you are not allowed to do that! Remember Eben Moglens talk on the war against general purpose computing.
    - rquantz 13y ago
      It is already illegal to access certain websites. It's just that those websites are generally considered morally abhorrent. I'm not necessarily arguing against your point, except to say that slippery slopes are generally more complicated than the people warning against them think they are.
      - 13y ago
- antocv 13y ago
  So is it "a viewing" that is being sold? Are they buying my eyes, am I selling? How much do other companies pay for my eyes to see their shit advertisement even though Im not selling? And I dont get or see any of that money. I already payed for the bandwidth to see the movie, it was already on my private property, it is my right to save it and to re-sell it or to mix it with other movies. But no, the intellectual right of the creator supersedes private property, and even my own intellectual creativity - no remixing. Send intellectual property and rights to the trashcan, write into the constitution that anything written and created is available for remixing and redistribution by any means.
  - br78 13y ago
    You're allowed to remix it as much as you like in your own home for your own amusement, the problem comes when you publicly release that remix.
    - pessimizer 13y ago
      Not really. Once you subvert the DRM module, you've already broken the law.
    - tesseractive 13y ago
      Though enforcement is a gray area as long as it's a noncommercial release and is not a realistic substitute for purchasing the original copyrighted content. Even the RIAA never tried to sue DJs releasing free online mixes they made.
- shmerl 13y ago
  Nothing is justifiable for DRM. Even if you don't watch movies over and over again, you can watch them once in a while. Good movies have good replay value. And bad movies won't get any more sales, just because they'll use DRM for some reason.
kefka 13y ago
Try buying your smartphones from China, from places like AliExpress. I just bought a Samsung Mega clone, 1.2 GHz quad core, 1G ram, 16GB storage, 2 sim cards, 2 batteries. Camera's even better than the Samsung offerings too. $200 US. And they come unlocked and prerooted, ready for your hackings and exploits.* You just have to be smart where you do business. Our US dollars really are an effective weapon to wield against other entities. Especially in cases of locked devices, there are answers we can respond to. You just have to be aware that those choices exist, rather than say the Galaxy Note 3 with region SIM locking. And I also have 0 problems with piracy, at all. I haven't a problem with paying for content and services. I've paid for a fair share of DVDs, VHS, CDs, tapes, and other forms of media... many times over. And then, they want me to pay for it again just because it's in another format? Nope. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, and I take matters in my own hands. *http://www.aliexpress.com/item/new-arrival-in-may-6-Haipai-N7889-MTK6589-Quad-Core-android-phone-1GB-RAM-16GB-Dual/934112323.html http://www.aliexpress.com/item/new-arrival-in-may-6-Haipai-N...
- learningram 13y ago
  Hey, care to share your review on the phone..Broke my phone and don't have the budget for a 600$ phone
  - kefka 13y ago
    Sure. It's the profile (except thickness) of a Samsung Mega. The actual viewable screen size is smaller than a mega but larger than the Note 2. You need to see it to understand how exactly big this phone is. It's by far one of the biggest phones I've seen (and used). I paid extra for expedited shipping, and the total was $213, and got it in 6 or 7 days. It comes with 3 cases: a standard back, a snap-on hardcase for the back, and a back with a cloth-hard flap lid. I use that third one so it protects the screen. If you want 3rd party equipment for this, AliExpress does have _some_ n7889 stuff, but nothing like the OtterBoxes. The phone itself feels sturdy, and not like a bootleg. Also note, there's no samsung logos anywhere (unlike some of the fake iphones that have peel-off stickers of the apple logo). The first thing I noticed is how buttery smooth everything is. I like that mushroom live wallpaper, and I've never seen a frame drop or lag at all. Don't get me wrong, I'm not much of a gamer, but Angry Birds is also perfect too. Everything just is so fast (faster than my few year old laptop). Do note, that the screen is a BIG battery eater. Then again, it's a big screen. There is a GPS on the device, however weirdly there is no compass. So the Google skydome does weird behavior. But that's not a big deal to me. Also, the stylus is NOT a S-pen. It's just a capacitive touch end, and the stylus does NOT work on the touch 'Back' and 'Home' buttons. I'm not sure if they do or don't work like that on the Note's, either. However, the screen can take up to 5 inputs (that does surprise me). You can see that with mobileuncle tools and go into engineer mode. The device DOES have an FM radio, unlike Samsungs. And you can record FM channels (coooool), but you need headphones hooked in. I also notice better antenna and cell strength than my previous iPhone 3GS. And about the Cell: there's 2 sim cards. The first slot supports 3G AT&T frequencies, and the second slot is a 2G. The idea is you can do calls on both, and fast data on the first slot. There's a sim manager in the settings that you can do cool stuff like bind a user to a certain SIM. It also supports Miracast, or "Wireless Display". Went into a Best Buy and demoed that out. Evidently, the Samsung phones cannot handle miracast when you change orientation. This phone can. Ive never seen this before, and it was DAMN sweet :P Ended up playing Psy's Gentleman (it was a HD video I grabbed and threw on there to see the quality of the screen). It's running Android 4.2.1 and uses MTK chipset. I don't think it'd be terribly hard to update the rom, as there are 2 3rd party rom mods for this phone. Phone model is Haipai Noble n7889

by antocv 13y ago

sudomal 13y ago

Movies are probably the most easily justifiable for DRM. They aren't the sorts of 'products' that people watch over and over again (unless they get a cult following). A single viewing of a movie reduces the value to a point where it may not be purchased. That's why distributors release them in as many stunted, protected, phases as possible - they want a return on their investment before it becomes relatively worthless.

DanBC 13y ago
> Movies are probably the most easily justifiable for DRM. They aren't the sorts of 'products' that people watch over and over again (unless they get a cult following). Children watch movies VERY MANY TIMES. They also manage to destroy the physical media. I'm not sure what the law is about making a backup of the disc (is backup exempted, or am I circumventing an effective copyright measure?) but morally I think it's okay to make a back up of a DVD. Having said that, I'm on my 3rd DVD of Despicable Me.
- chris_wot 13y ago
  > Children watch movies VERY MANY TIMES. They also manage to destroy the physical media. 100% agreed and can personally attest to that!!
  - menubar 13y ago
    These kids are destroying property that does not belong to them. This is a felony punishable by prison time and hard labor. You'd better turn them in at the nearest police station before Hollywood finds out and sends their hired thugs after you.
    - chris_wot 13y ago
      Believe me, there are some days I'm sorely tempted!
    - aaronem 13y ago
      What? I mean, full marks for hyperbole, but even DIVX never tried to claim the buyer didn't own the physical medium. It's the ownership of the bits stored thereon that's under discussion.
- PeterisP 13y ago
  Making backups as such is legal under general global copyright laws. In USA however, if a content seller makes it very difficult to make a backup, then distributing devices to circumvent that may be illegal under DMCA.
- ensignavenger 13y ago
  Are they scratching the disks to cause the damage- or are they actually wearing the disks out??? (Just curious- I agree 100% that you should have the right to make a backup of a DVD in case it gets destroyed.
stonith 13y ago
I dislike DRM in all of its forms, and hope that Mozilla does take a stance against having it in FF, but I agree with this sentiment. I don't want to own a movie, I want to watch it. I don't want to own music, I want to listen to it. What I don't agree with is the assumption from content producers that DRM is particularly useful. If the content is displayed on a screen or played out speakers, DRM isn't going to work.
- SeanDav 13y ago
  Except if you don't own it you may be told you can't watch the film with more than 2 friends or on Friday evenings or Christmas Eve. You may be told you cannot listen to your music if travelling to another country, or copy it to your new $10,000 hi-fi so you can really enjoy it.
belorn 13y ago
Media distributors have all the right to modify their works in any way they feel like. It is after all their property and they should enjoy the Property rights associated with it. If they want to encrypt it, scramble it, create CDs with strange sectors, they are completely free to do so. My hardware however is not theirs, it's mine. I should have the same property rights to my property as they should have to theirs. Goods that still are controlled by the manufacturer has thus been designed to infringe on my property rights after ownership has been transfered. It is wrong, and should be illegal. DRM is a technical design to corrupt property rights. The actual owner has none of the rights in "Bundle of rights"¹. One losses any of the control associated with property rights². It removes the concept of private property in ways we should never allow. It is simply a worse crime in history than eminent domain, mostly because everyone nowadays carries it in their pocket. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bundle_of_rights https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bundle_of_rights 2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Property_rights https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Property_rights
- antocv 13y ago
  Lets not forget the laws against reverse-engineering. Lets not forget that people were seriously wondering if "jail-breaking" their iPhones is illegal or not. Thats how far it has gone. Its a disgrace to anything that a democratic liberal society is. What is next, you are not allowed to run a certain program on your devices? Then it will be illegal to access certain web-sites with your devices. Then perhaps it will be illegal to have read a text on a print-out. Watch out, citizen, what you are writing is illegal, you are not allowed to do that! Remember Eben Moglens talk on the war against general purpose computing.
  - rquantz 13y ago
    It is already illegal to access certain websites. It's just that those websites are generally considered morally abhorrent. I'm not necessarily arguing against your point, except to say that slippery slopes are generally more complicated than the people warning against them think they are.
    - 13y ago
antocv 13y ago
So is it "a viewing" that is being sold? Are they buying my eyes, am I selling? How much do other companies pay for my eyes to see their shit advertisement even though Im not selling? And I dont get or see any of that money. I already payed for the bandwidth to see the movie, it was already on my private property, it is my right to save it and to re-sell it or to mix it with other movies. But no, the intellectual right of the creator supersedes private property, and even my own intellectual creativity - no remixing. Send intellectual property and rights to the trashcan, write into the constitution that anything written and created is available for remixing and redistribution by any means.
- br78 13y ago
  You're allowed to remix it as much as you like in your own home for your own amusement, the problem comes when you publicly release that remix.
  - pessimizer 13y ago
    Not really. Once you subvert the DRM module, you've already broken the law.
  - tesseractive 13y ago
    Though enforcement is a gray area as long as it's a noncommercial release and is not a realistic substitute for purchasing the original copyrighted content. Even the RIAA never tried to sue DJs releasing free online mixes they made.
shmerl 13y ago
Nothing is justifiable for DRM. Even if you don't watch movies over and over again, you can watch them once in a while. Good movies have good replay value. And bad movies won't get any more sales, just because they'll use DRM for some reason.

kefka 13y ago

Try buying your smartphones from China, from places like AliExpress. I just bought a Samsung Mega clone, 1.2 GHz quad core, 1G ram, 16GB storage, 2 sim cards, 2 batteries. Camera's even better than the Samsung offerings too. $200 US. And they come unlocked and prerooted, ready for your hackings and exploits.* You just have to be smart where you do business. Our US dollars really are an effective weapon to wield against other entities. Especially in cases of locked devices, there are answers we can respond to. You just have to be aware that those choices exist, rather than say the Galaxy Note 3 with region SIM locking. And I also have 0 problems with piracy, at all. I haven't a problem with paying for content and services. I've paid for a fair share of DVDs, VHS, CDs, tapes, and other forms of media... many times over. And then, they want me to pay for it again just because it's in another format? Nope. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, and I take matters in my own hands. *http://www.aliexpress.com/item/new-arrival-in-may-6-Haipai-N7889-MTK6589-Quad-Core-android-phone-1GB-RAM-16GB-Dual/934112323.html http://www.aliexpress.com/item/new-arrival-in-may-6-Haipai-N...

learningram 13y ago
Hey, care to share your review on the phone..Broke my phone and don't have the budget for a 600$ phone
- kefka 13y ago
  Sure. It's the profile (except thickness) of a Samsung Mega. The actual viewable screen size is smaller than a mega but larger than the Note 2. You need to see it to understand how exactly big this phone is. It's by far one of the biggest phones I've seen (and used). I paid extra for expedited shipping, and the total was $213, and got it in 6 or 7 days. It comes with 3 cases: a standard back, a snap-on hardcase for the back, and a back with a cloth-hard flap lid. I use that third one so it protects the screen. If you want 3rd party equipment for this, AliExpress does have _some_ n7889 stuff, but nothing like the OtterBoxes. The phone itself feels sturdy, and not like a bootleg. Also note, there's no samsung logos anywhere (unlike some of the fake iphones that have peel-off stickers of the apple logo). The first thing I noticed is how buttery smooth everything is. I like that mushroom live wallpaper, and I've never seen a frame drop or lag at all. Don't get me wrong, I'm not much of a gamer, but Angry Birds is also perfect too. Everything just is so fast (faster than my few year old laptop). Do note, that the screen is a BIG battery eater. Then again, it's a big screen. There is a GPS on the device, however weirdly there is no compass. So the Google skydome does weird behavior. But that's not a big deal to me. Also, the stylus is NOT a S-pen. It's just a capacitive touch end, and the stylus does NOT work on the touch 'Back' and 'Home' buttons. I'm not sure if they do or don't work like that on the Note's, either. However, the screen can take up to 5 inputs (that does surprise me). You can see that with mobileuncle tools and go into engineer mode. The device DOES have an FM radio, unlike Samsungs. And you can record FM channels (coooool), but you need headphones hooked in. I also notice better antenna and cell strength than my previous iPhone 3GS. And about the Cell: there's 2 sim cards. The first slot supports 3G AT&T frequencies, and the second slot is a 2G. The idea is you can do calls on both, and fast data on the first slot. There's a sim manager in the settings that you can do cool stuff like bind a user to a certain SIM. It also supports Miracast, or "Wireless Display". Went into a Best Buy and demoed that out. Evidently, the Samsung phones cannot handle miracast when you change orientation. This phone can. Ive never seen this before, and it was DAMN sweet :P Ended up playing Psy's Gentleman (it was a HD video I grabbed and threw on there to see the quality of the screen). It's running Android 4.2.1 and uses MTK chipset. I don't think it'd be terribly hard to update the rom, as there are 2 3rd party rom mods for this phone. Phone model is Haipai Noble n7889