4 ms·

I agree 100% with the author about the spoiled brat mentality of this generation of developers. I personally prefer to hire older developers because a) they ten

I agree 100% with the author about the spoiled brat mentality of this generation of developers. I personally prefer to hire older developers because a) they tend to be steady producers, and b) they have the maturity to understand that sometimes work sucks and c) provided managers don't treat them like shit, they tend to stick around. The flip side of the deal is I am not going to work them to death or make unreasonable demands unless we're in a do or die situation. Guess what kids. Work can be boring. If you're writing reporting software for a utility grid monitoring company, it's probably not your "passion", but it'll pay for your mortgage, your kids school, and time off.

nostrademons 13y ago
It's perfectly fine for you to hire older developers, particularly if you're writing reporting software for a utility grid monitoring company. A younger developer probably isn't going to want to do that job anyway. The reason we have a market economy in the first place is so that people can find the work the matches their interests and abilities best, and then get paid well for doing it to the best of their abilities.
- swah 13y ago
  Why a younger developer wouldn't want to write reporting software for a grid monitoring company? Sounds more interesting than webapps.
  - nostrademons 13y ago
    I don't think there's anything stopping them if they really do. The grandparent poster is talking about people who think they "above" the work. Someone who really wants to do the work isn't going to act like they're above it, and is probably going to do just fine at it. That's the system working as intended.
aragot 13y ago
> b) they have the maturity to understand that sometimes work sucks and c) provided managers don't treat them like shit, they tend to stick around. Flip it around: What happens when you pay non-seniors at a non-senior rate? They go get a better paid job. How surprising.
Iftheshoefits 13y ago
My experience with "enterprise" development ("writing reporting software", or "CRUD replacement for Excel Spreadsheet X") is that those companies don't actually pay decent salaries, even for the mundane, trivial development work required. They might "pay the mortgage" in some one-horse town in the midwest or deep south, but in places where most people live they won't. What's more, those settings are usually filled with toxic garbage like cliques of people who've been there 5, 10, 20 years and play gossip or petty politics games, middle-managers who view their subordinates as enemies (competition) or scapegoats (when said middle-managers fail to deliver because of their own inability to lead a team), and departments who treat developers like unskilled labor or some sort of awkward add-on to the IT department. Middle- and upper-management at these places are some of the most spoiled self-entitled pricks I've ever encountered. They are also frequently the most unjustifiably arrogant, incompetent hypocrites in the organization. Sure, somebody has to do the work in those settings. More power to the people who can. That doesn't mean they're better people (or worse) than those who can't stomach that kind of work or putting up with the spoiled-brat, unjustifiably arrogant faux-authority of petty jerk managers. It takes real maturity--not the fake, arbitrary kind you suggest in (b)--to understand that. This isn't to pooh-pooh your points (a) and (c) about older workers; being an older worker (in IT terms; I'm mid-30s) I see what inexperience (which is most often associated with youth) means in terms of output, focus, and durability. But neither one fits in with your larger narrative necessarily.

nostrademons 13y ago

It's perfectly fine for you to hire older developers, particularly if you're writing reporting software for a utility grid monitoring company. A younger developer probably isn't going to want to do that job anyway. The reason we have a market economy in the first place is so that people can find the work the matches their interests and abilities best, and then get paid well for doing it to the best of their abilities.

swah 13y ago
Why a younger developer wouldn't want to write reporting software for a grid monitoring company? Sounds more interesting than webapps.
- nostrademons 13y ago
  I don't think there's anything stopping them if they really do. The grandparent poster is talking about people who think they "above" the work. Someone who really wants to do the work isn't going to act like they're above it, and is probably going to do just fine at it. That's the system working as intended.

aragot 13y ago

> b) they have the maturity to understand that sometimes work sucks and c) provided managers don't treat them like shit, they tend to stick around. Flip it around: What happens when you pay non-seniors at a non-senior rate? They go get a better paid job. How surprising.

Iftheshoefits 13y ago

My experience with "enterprise" development ("writing reporting software", or "CRUD replacement for Excel Spreadsheet X") is that those companies don't actually pay decent salaries, even for the mundane, trivial development work required. They might "pay the mortgage" in some one-horse town in the midwest or deep south, but in places where most people live they won't. What's more, those settings are usually filled with toxic garbage like cliques of people who've been there 5, 10, 20 years and play gossip or petty politics games, middle-managers who view their subordinates as enemies (competition) or scapegoats (when said middle-managers fail to deliver because of their own inability to lead a team), and departments who treat developers like unskilled labor or some sort of awkward add-on to the IT department. Middle- and upper-management at these places are some of the most spoiled self-entitled pricks I've ever encountered. They are also frequently the most unjustifiably arrogant, incompetent hypocrites in the organization. Sure, somebody has to do the work in those settings. More power to the people who can. That doesn't mean they're better people (or worse) than those who can't stomach that kind of work or putting up with the spoiled-brat, unjustifiably arrogant faux-authority of petty jerk managers. It takes real maturity--not the fake, arbitrary kind you suggest in (b)--to understand that. This isn't to pooh-pooh your points (a) and (c) about older workers; being an older worker (in IT terms; I'm mid-30s) I see what inexperience (which is most often associated with youth) means in terms of output, focus, and durability. But neither one fits in with your larger narrative necessarily.