5 ms·

I really can't stand feminism. I'm all for women learning to program, though. In fact, I put more support in women learning than men. We do need more women p

by mumbi 13y ago

I really can't stand feminism. I'm all for women learning to program, though. In fact, I put more support in women learning than men. We do need more women programming. Feminism though, no.

sp332 13y ago
I didn't understand this for a long time, but the best way to approach the texts is not as a debate where you have to critically analyze the positions and pick a side. You literally don't have to agree with a single assertion they make. Just let them sit in your head as: this person had this experience, and this is how they interpreted it. Eventually you will build a very complex and self-contradictory map. You will find people who call themselves "feminists" on every side of each argument. Such a confusing mess seems counter-productive if you're trying to objectively solve a puzzle. But it will benefit you immensely in terms of experience and empathy. You can still disagree with people, just don't dismiss them.
colmvp 13y ago
In fact, I put more support in women learning than men. Absolutely. Damn those privileged Black and Hispanic men in tech!
untog 13y ago
What, exactly, do you think feminism is?
- mumbi 13y ago
  Probably the same thing as you(equality). But what it is or is supposed to be isn't my issue. My issue is the outcome.
  - bitops 13y ago
    And that outcome is?
    - mumbi 13y ago
      Degradation of society as a whole.
      - bitops 13y ago
        That's a very strong statement. Without a more detailed and eloquent defense, I'll have a hard time taking you seriously.
- VladRussian2 13y ago
  in the context of that given blog it seems that feminism is anti-thetical stereotype to the stereotype of all the bad stuff the blog attributes to "white men"
- asgard1024 13y ago
  I clicked on this link: http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/09/the-brogrammer-effect-women-are-a-small-and-shrinking-share-of-computer-workers/279611/ http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/09/the-brog... and I honestly think it's awful. Calling programmers "brogrammers" is a sexist label to begin with. More is explained in the comments. This is not an attitude that helps anybody. Regardless, maybe it simply doesn't have an explanation. You see, humans (and yes, women are humans) have herd mentality. And just like we get financial bubbles, maybe we get gender bubbles, with different genders doing different jobs. There is no "why", just like there is no why you rolled 1 on dice. In the book Butterfly Economics, there is a famous experiment described. You have an anthill, and you place 2 heaps of food at the same distance from it. The ants normally leave pheromone trail, and basically decide where to go partly based on the trail (that is, decisions made by other ants) and partly independently of it. What happens? Intuition would suggest that ants will divide 50/50 between the two food heaps, or very close to that. However, in the real world, the ratio of ants taking the food will fluctuate wildly, with up to 80/20 ants going to one heap. Then it may swing the other direction, and so on.
fogus 13y ago
From what I've gathered while researching this blog post, the term feminism has as many facets and internal conflicts as any other system of thought. It seems unfair to dismiss "feminism" as a whole.

by mumbi 13y ago

I really can't stand feminism. I'm all for women learning to program, though. In fact, I put more support in women learning than men. We do need more women programming. Feminism though, no.

sp332 13y ago

I didn't understand this for a long time, but the best way to approach the texts is not as a debate where you have to critically analyze the positions and pick a side. You literally don't have to agree with a single assertion they make. Just let them sit in your head as: this person had this experience, and this is how they interpreted it. Eventually you will build a very complex and self-contradictory map. You will find people who call themselves "feminists" on every side of each argument. Such a confusing mess seems counter-productive if you're trying to objectively solve a puzzle. But it will benefit you immensely in terms of experience and empathy. You can still disagree with people, just don't dismiss them.

colmvp 13y ago

In fact, I put more support in women learning than men. Absolutely. Damn those privileged Black and Hispanic men in tech!

untog 13y ago

What, exactly, do you think feminism is?

mumbi 13y ago
Probably the same thing as you(equality). But what it is or is supposed to be isn't my issue. My issue is the outcome.
- bitops 13y ago
  And that outcome is?
  - mumbi 13y ago
    Degradation of society as a whole.
    - bitops 13y ago
      That's a very strong statement. Without a more detailed and eloquent defense, I'll have a hard time taking you seriously.
VladRussian2 13y ago
in the context of that given blog it seems that feminism is anti-thetical stereotype to the stereotype of all the bad stuff the blog attributes to "white men"
asgard1024 13y ago
I clicked on this link: http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/09/the-brogrammer-effect-women-are-a-small-and-shrinking-share-of-computer-workers/279611/ http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/09/the-brog... and I honestly think it's awful. Calling programmers "brogrammers" is a sexist label to begin with. More is explained in the comments. This is not an attitude that helps anybody. Regardless, maybe it simply doesn't have an explanation. You see, humans (and yes, women are humans) have herd mentality. And just like we get financial bubbles, maybe we get gender bubbles, with different genders doing different jobs. There is no "why", just like there is no why you rolled 1 on dice. In the book Butterfly Economics, there is a famous experiment described. You have an anthill, and you place 2 heaps of food at the same distance from it. The ants normally leave pheromone trail, and basically decide where to go partly based on the trail (that is, decisions made by other ants) and partly independently of it. What happens? Intuition would suggest that ants will divide 50/50 between the two food heaps, or very close to that. However, in the real world, the ratio of ants taking the food will fluctuate wildly, with up to 80/20 ants going to one heap. Then it may swing the other direction, and so on.

fogus 13y ago

From what I've gathered while researching this blog post, the term feminism has as many facets and internal conflicts as any other system of thought. It seems unfair to dismiss "feminism" as a whole.