4 ms·

Remember that Rust is still a rapidly changing language, and releases have very little connotation of stability, support, or any other guarantees. They're rele

Remember that Rust is still a rapidly changing language, and releases have very little connotation of stability, support, or any other guarantees. They're released on a schedule, not by features. They're useful to be able to refer to periods of time in Rust's rapidly changing lifetime, but not much beyond that.

mscottmcbee 13y ago
So 1.0 will be released at a certain time regardless of features?
- steveklabnik 13y ago
  10 is the number that comes after 9, so I'd expect a 0.10. Rust has SemVer baked into its standard library, and the package manager (hopefully soon) will assume SemVer.
  - wmf 13y ago
    So I guess the version number is not intended to give any hint about how close Rust is to being frozen.
    - steveklabnik 13y ago
      That is correct. Please see my comment here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6454497 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6454497
  - ris 13y ago
    A package manager? Oh god.
    - steveklabnik 13y ago
      Yup. rustpkg is a build tool that knows how to pull in dependencies and build them, too. It is of course not mandatory, and won't really be used to distribute binary versions of Rust programs, just the source.
steveklabnik 13y ago
Absolutely. Milestones are a better indicator of that: https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues/milestones https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues/milestones Specifically, maturity #5 - production ready: https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues?milestone=16&state=open https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues?milestone=16&state=op... > The purpose of this milestone is to represent a high degree of confidence the > language's suitability for industrial use due to a high level of measured > correctness and performance in the tests. > In other words, for each of the aspects described in the "well covered" > milestone, and for each supported target platform, test success and benchmark > performance has reached a level deemed suitable for production use in > environments with substantial business consequences for major defects or low > performance. Where possible, performance benchmarks are linked to equivalent > benchmarks in competitive languages, and rust is sufficiently close to > equivalent in performance.
- marshray 13y ago
  I like https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues?milestone=13&page=1&state=open https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues?milestone=13&page=1&s... > maturity #2 - backwards compatible > we are comfortable making a long-term support commitment to downstream > users (servo in particular) to keep the set of symbols, definitions > and passing-tests from contracting
ternaryoperator 13y ago
This! I so want to play with Rust. I want to explore it over programs that are several thousand lines long, so I can get a real flavor for it. But the rate of change especially to important elements of the language is still too great. I don't want to rewrite the code to stay abreast of revs. Not a critique by any means--I admire the language and the work being done. More of a wish that the core language syntax would settle down soon.
- steveklabnik 13y ago
  To be clear, the syntax changes in this release were very minor. It's mostly the standard library and runtime that are changing at this time. That doesn't mean that your sentiment is wrong; if you don't want to be keeping up with the langauge's changes, certainly don't write projects in Rust. That said, there are more libraries than you'd expect, including a few that are several thousands of lines.
  - dbaupp 13y ago
    > To be clear, the syntax changes in this release were very minor Yeah, only the entire for loop syntax changed. ;)
    - steveklabnik 13y ago
      And it was fixable with a regular expression. :)
- nullc 13y ago
  Of course, the change also means your play might have an impact still: If you use it and find something about the design stinks, wastes your time, induces errors, etc... while the language is still in flux there exists the possibility of fixing these things. In this regard it couldn't be a better time to try it out.
- mcpherrinm 13y ago
  I've been writing Rust code off and on, and even moving some code from back in February to the recent trunk codebase wasn't that painful: Yes, there were some changes I had to make, and the code isn't perfectly idiomatic modern Rust, but it does run. I wouldn't devote a crucial project, school assignment, or startup to rust. But for some toy side projects, or small programs, it's not so bad right now.

mscottmcbee 13y ago

So 1.0 will be released at a certain time regardless of features?

steveklabnik 13y ago
10 is the number that comes after 9, so I'd expect a 0.10. Rust has SemVer baked into its standard library, and the package manager (hopefully soon) will assume SemVer.
- wmf 13y ago
  So I guess the version number is not intended to give any hint about how close Rust is to being frozen.
  - steveklabnik 13y ago
    That is correct. Please see my comment here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6454497 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6454497
- ris 13y ago
  A package manager? Oh god.
  - steveklabnik 13y ago
    Yup. rustpkg is a build tool that knows how to pull in dependencies and build them, too. It is of course not mandatory, and won't really be used to distribute binary versions of Rust programs, just the source.

steveklabnik 13y ago

Absolutely. Milestones are a better indicator of that: https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues/milestones https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues/milestones Specifically, maturity #5 - production ready: https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues?milestone=16&state=open https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues?milestone=16&state=op... > The purpose of this milestone is to represent a high degree of confidence the > language's suitability for industrial use due to a high level of measured > correctness and performance in the tests. > In other words, for each of the aspects described in the "well covered" > milestone, and for each supported target platform, test success and benchmark > performance has reached a level deemed suitable for production use in > environments with substantial business consequences for major defects or low > performance. Where possible, performance benchmarks are linked to equivalent > benchmarks in competitive languages, and rust is sufficiently close to > equivalent in performance.

marshray 13y ago
I like https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues?milestone=13&page=1&state=open https://github.com/mozilla/rust/issues?milestone=13&page=1&s... > maturity #2 - backwards compatible > we are comfortable making a long-term support commitment to downstream > users (servo in particular) to keep the set of symbols, definitions > and passing-tests from contracting

ternaryoperator 13y ago

This! I so want to play with Rust. I want to explore it over programs that are several thousand lines long, so I can get a real flavor for it. But the rate of change especially to important elements of the language is still too great. I don't want to rewrite the code to stay abreast of revs. Not a critique by any means--I admire the language and the work being done. More of a wish that the core language syntax would settle down soon.

steveklabnik 13y ago
To be clear, the syntax changes in this release were very minor. It's mostly the standard library and runtime that are changing at this time. That doesn't mean that your sentiment is wrong; if you don't want to be keeping up with the langauge's changes, certainly don't write projects in Rust. That said, there are more libraries than you'd expect, including a few that are several thousands of lines.
- dbaupp 13y ago
  > To be clear, the syntax changes in this release were very minor Yeah, only the entire for loop syntax changed. ;)
  - steveklabnik 13y ago
    And it was fixable with a regular expression. :)
nullc 13y ago
Of course, the change also means your play might have an impact still: If you use it and find something about the design stinks, wastes your time, induces errors, etc... while the language is still in flux there exists the possibility of fixing these things. In this regard it couldn't be a better time to try it out.
mcpherrinm 13y ago
I've been writing Rust code off and on, and even moving some code from back in February to the recent trunk codebase wasn't that painful: Yes, there were some changes I had to make, and the code isn't perfectly idiomatic modern Rust, but it does run. I wouldn't devote a crucial project, school assignment, or startup to rust. But for some toy side projects, or small programs, it's not so bad right now.