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Wow, this guy got downvoted fast and unfairly in my opinion. He stated a fact. I don't know what the Nigeria attack is, but in the three other attacks he liste

by steve19 13y ago

Wow, this guy got downvoted fast and unfairly in my opinion. He stated a fact. I don't know what the Nigeria attack is, but in the three other attacks he listed the enemy is known and in two of those attacks they wore uniforms. Drones have been used against at least one of those groups. I think people don't like the term "Islamic" being used, but they were done by groups claiming to be Islamic, and reported in the media as Islamic. I am tired of the constant straw man arguments "but we have killed more people", "but christians are also terrorists" etc. Debate the issue at hand instead. Who are our enemy (if anyone) and how do we deal with them?

joshuaellinger 13y ago
Replace the word "Islamic" with "Poor and Black/Brown" and you've selected the same group of people. Imagine being in Northern Ireland 20 years ago and stating the fact that all of the terrorist attackers were performed by "Catholics". Or in the Deep South 40 years ago (or today) and saying that all of the people charged with stealing are "Black". Or that most of the people with AIDS are "Gay". Unfortunately, the blanket targeting of a single group is really part of the problem. Pretending that it is tied to religion is just weakly hidden fear-of-the-other. The down-votes are just the quick-and-easy way to show that the community doesn't accept the cheap shot and sees it for what it really is.
- yapcguy 13y ago
  > Pretending that it is tied to religion is just weakly hidden fear-of-the-other. The killers are quoting from religious text and openly declare they are fighting a religious war. If there were only one or two people doing this, you could claim they were mentally ill, but you have thousands of people doing this, all over the world. You can't tar everybody with the same brush, but it's obvious that religion is part of the problem.
  - droope 13y ago
    why do you say islam is part of the problem? I ask because I genuinely don't understand...
  - joshuaellinger 13y ago
    In order to be motivated enough to kill other people, you have to get your head into a pretty weird place. Religion is one path there. The religion that happens to dominate countries full of desperate people is... Islam. I think Christians have a bigger body count than Muslims over the course of human history, primarily because the Europeans happen to be Christian. Hard to think of any religion that hasn't been used to justify a bunch of violence and murder. The violence by people quoting Islam today is mice nuts compared to (a) the crusades, (b) the protestant reformation, (c) the colonization of the new world. You should really read Guns, Germs, and Steel before claiming that there is something special about this particular religion. Get a little sense of history. Islam in the 600s was amazingly progressive. Look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_inheritance_jurisprudence http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_inheritance_jurispruden....
yapcguy 13y ago
http://allafrica.com/stories/201309200714.html http://allafrica.com/stories/201309200714.html >"Heavily armed insurgents laid siege on Benisheik, Kaga Local Government Area on Tuesday evening, killing people and setting buildings ablaze. They also blocked the Maiduguri-Damaturu highway, three kilometers away from the town, sorting out and slaughtering dozens of travelers. Apart from the 142 travellers, also killed in the attack were 2 soldiers, 3 policemen and 14 villagers,bringing the total death toll to 161." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boko_Haram http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boko_Haram >"an Islamic jihadist militant terrorist organisation based in the northeast of Nigeria[4] north Cameroon and Niger.[5][6][7][8] It is an Islamist movement which strongly opposes non-Sharia legal systems, and what they deem "Westernization." Founded by Mohammed Yusuf in 2001,[9] the organisation seeks to establish sharia law in the country."

by steve19 13y ago

joshuaellinger 13y ago

Replace the word "Islamic" with "Poor and Black/Brown" and you've selected the same group of people. Imagine being in Northern Ireland 20 years ago and stating the fact that all of the terrorist attackers were performed by "Catholics". Or in the Deep South 40 years ago (or today) and saying that all of the people charged with stealing are "Black". Or that most of the people with AIDS are "Gay". Unfortunately, the blanket targeting of a single group is really part of the problem. Pretending that it is tied to religion is just weakly hidden fear-of-the-other. The down-votes are just the quick-and-easy way to show that the community doesn't accept the cheap shot and sees it for what it really is.

yapcguy 13y ago
> Pretending that it is tied to religion is just weakly hidden fear-of-the-other. The killers are quoting from religious text and openly declare they are fighting a religious war. If there were only one or two people doing this, you could claim they were mentally ill, but you have thousands of people doing this, all over the world. You can't tar everybody with the same brush, but it's obvious that religion is part of the problem.
- droope 13y ago
  why do you say islam is part of the problem? I ask because I genuinely don't understand...
- joshuaellinger 13y ago
  In order to be motivated enough to kill other people, you have to get your head into a pretty weird place. Religion is one path there. The religion that happens to dominate countries full of desperate people is... Islam. I think Christians have a bigger body count than Muslims over the course of human history, primarily because the Europeans happen to be Christian. Hard to think of any religion that hasn't been used to justify a bunch of violence and murder. The violence by people quoting Islam today is mice nuts compared to (a) the crusades, (b) the protestant reformation, (c) the colonization of the new world. You should really read Guns, Germs, and Steel before claiming that there is something special about this particular religion. Get a little sense of history. Islam in the 600s was amazingly progressive. Look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_inheritance_jurisprudence http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_inheritance_jurispruden....

yapcguy 13y ago

http://allafrica.com/stories/201309200714.html http://allafrica.com/stories/201309200714.html >"Heavily armed insurgents laid siege on Benisheik, Kaga Local Government Area on Tuesday evening, killing people and setting buildings ablaze. They also blocked the Maiduguri-Damaturu highway, three kilometers away from the town, sorting out and slaughtering dozens of travelers. Apart from the 142 travellers, also killed in the attack were 2 soldiers, 3 policemen and 14 villagers,bringing the total death toll to 161." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boko_Haram http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boko_Haram >"an Islamic jihadist militant terrorist organisation based in the northeast of Nigeria[4] north Cameroon and Niger.[5][6][7][8] It is an Islamist movement which strongly opposes non-Sharia legal systems, and what they deem "Westernization." Founded by Mohammed Yusuf in 2001,[9] the organisation seeks to establish sharia law in the country."