6 ms·

politics and software are tightly coupled independent of whether you pretend it's not... regarding your second paragraph, fsf needs money to carry campaigns to

by destan 13y ago

politics and software are tightly coupled independent of whether you pretend it's not... regarding your second paragraph, fsf needs money to carry campaigns to tell the people about the inconvenient truth.

profquail 13y ago
Can you explain to me why, in your opinion, politics and software are tightly coupled? Or perhaps provide a citation to an explanation from a (preferably unbiased) source? Without any evidence, I really don't see why these two things must go together.
- dllthomas 13y ago
  http://harvardmagazine.com/2000/01/code-is-law-html http://harvardmagazine.com/2000/01/code-is-law-html
  - sbuk 13y ago
    I wouldn't cite Lawrence Lessig as unbiased.
    - dllthomas 13y ago
      Perhaps not, but it's an obscure enough question that it's not going to be analyzed in any depth by someone without some interest nearby. And the parent did say "preferably unbiased", leaving some implication that a biased source is acceptable absent others. Regardless, the arguments can be evaluated on their merits - Lessig is certainly a serious participant in the discussion.
- pjc50 13y ago
  Consumption of _anything_ has political implications, albeit trivial ones: you support whoever made it, and the process by which it was made. I don't think there's anything which can truly be declared apolitical, because people can always _make_ it political. Not necessarily "party" politics, but any case where there are costs and benefits which accrue to different groups.
epistasis 13y ago
I don't disagree that politics and software have close ties. But I fervently disagree with the particular politics of the FSF, even though we share common goals. However, the FSF is absolutist and views their particular politics as inseparable from the goals, almost as if the politics are the goal itself. This is at best childish, because mixed in with their message that contains "inconvenient truth" they also include a lot of unnecessary BS. The logic that accompanies their political reasoning is patchy and convoluted at best, but these holes are pasted over with overwhelming passion and feeling. I could support a more rational organization or lobby group, even if I didn't agree 100% with their politics, if we shared common goals. The FSF makes that impossible. They will therefore see no support from me, despite my continued support for our common goals.
- spacelizard 13y ago
  > the FSF is absolutist and views their particular politics as inseparable from the goals I often see this kind of hyperbole and it seems very meaningless to me. Their particular strategy has remained pretty consistent and has managed to fund development of a good number of successful projects. If it's their PR you have a problem with, what is it that you want them to say? That it's okay to support the use of proprietary software sometimes, even though that's completely against the whole point?
- Amadou 13y ago
  the FSF is absolutist If that were true they would have never created the LGPL. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Lesser_General_Public_License http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Lesser_General_Public_Licen...

by destan 13y ago

profquail 13y ago

Can you explain to me why, in your opinion, politics and software are tightly coupled? Or perhaps provide a citation to an explanation from a (preferably unbiased) source? Without any evidence, I really don't see why these two things must go together.

dllthomas 13y ago
http://harvardmagazine.com/2000/01/code-is-law-html http://harvardmagazine.com/2000/01/code-is-law-html
- sbuk 13y ago
  I wouldn't cite Lawrence Lessig as unbiased.
  - dllthomas 13y ago
    Perhaps not, but it's an obscure enough question that it's not going to be analyzed in any depth by someone without some interest nearby. And the parent did say "preferably unbiased", leaving some implication that a biased source is acceptable absent others. Regardless, the arguments can be evaluated on their merits - Lessig is certainly a serious participant in the discussion.
pjc50 13y ago
Consumption of _anything_ has political implications, albeit trivial ones: you support whoever made it, and the process by which it was made. I don't think there's anything which can truly be declared apolitical, because people can always _make_ it political. Not necessarily "party" politics, but any case where there are costs and benefits which accrue to different groups.

epistasis 13y ago

I don't disagree that politics and software have close ties. But I fervently disagree with the particular politics of the FSF, even though we share common goals. However, the FSF is absolutist and views their particular politics as inseparable from the goals, almost as if the politics are the goal itself. This is at best childish, because mixed in with their message that contains "inconvenient truth" they also include a lot of unnecessary BS. The logic that accompanies their political reasoning is patchy and convoluted at best, but these holes are pasted over with overwhelming passion and feeling. I could support a more rational organization or lobby group, even if I didn't agree 100% with their politics, if we shared common goals. The FSF makes that impossible. They will therefore see no support from me, despite my continued support for our common goals.

spacelizard 13y ago
> the FSF is absolutist and views their particular politics as inseparable from the goals I often see this kind of hyperbole and it seems very meaningless to me. Their particular strategy has remained pretty consistent and has managed to fund development of a good number of successful projects. If it's their PR you have a problem with, what is it that you want them to say? That it's okay to support the use of proprietary software sometimes, even though that's completely against the whole point?
Amadou 13y ago
the FSF is absolutist If that were true they would have never created the LGPL. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Lesser_General_Public_License http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Lesser_General_Public_Licen...