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I don't understand his constant line in the sand on this issue (amongst other things). You basically illustrated exactly how he structures his arguments on this

I don't understand his constant line in the sand on this issue (amongst other things). You basically illustrated exactly how he structures his arguments on this topic.

tptacek 13y ago
If I was smart enough to understand what this comment meant, I'd respond to it. Maybe you could clarify? I can't find a way to reconcile it with its parent comment in a way that gives me anything to discuss.
- icelancer 13y ago
  You seem to have already addressed it in another comment: >Thanks for the link. I would have just gone on confirming my own biases without it. This is incredibly evident in your comments on Dual_EC and sometimes happens on other comments as well. You draw a line in the sand and argue around it constantly, eventually bleeding into passive-aggressive attacks on the knowledge of others. I find it valuable to hear from others outside of my industry (which is not crypto) who have no expertise in that field. They often have a fresh and agnostic look at something. Do you think all these comments slinging mud at you - however inaccurate they may be - were born from nothing?
  - tptacek 13y ago
    How about this: why don't you tell me what you think my "line in the sand" is? I bet I don't have that line at all. I have a different explanation for why I always seem to be at odds with people on NSA topics, but I'll wait to provide it.
    - icelancer 13y ago
      >eventually bleeding into passive-aggressive attacks on the knowledge of others. Thanks for proving my point.
    - lawnchair_larry 13y ago
      > I have a different explanation for why I always seem to be at odds with people on NSA topics, but I'll wait to provide it. I'm very interested in that actually. I'm often curious what shapes people's perspectives on these issues, particularly if it doesn't align with any obvious incentives. I always thought that you must have family in law enforcement or something, but I'd love to know the actual reason.
      - tptacek 13y ago
        * NSA topics are heavy on computer security issues and legal issues. * I'm professionally involved in computer security, like you, and have an an amateur interest in the law (I'm considering law school at some point). * Message board nerds have a lot of weird, wrong beliefs about computer security and the law. There is a political difference between me and HN: I'm not an anarcho-capitalist (that silly "world's smallest political test" thingy puts me dead center in "left liberal"). But politics have little to do with where I end up on the NSA threads; it's things like not understanding (or really, having even skimmed) NIST crypto standards, or not taking the time to understand what the 4th Amendment means. The things that get me into "trouble" here have more to do with taking the time to actually read primary sources than anything else. We probably disagree about NSA a lot less than you think we do.
    - chris_wot 13y ago
      I have a different explanation for why I always seem to be at odds with people on NSA topics, but I'll wait to provide it. I hate it when people do that. If you have a position on something, don't leave us all guessing, just state it!

I don't understand his constant line in the sand on this issue (amongst other things). You basically illustrated exactly how he structures his arguments on this topic.

tptacek 13y ago

If I was smart enough to understand what this comment meant, I'd respond to it. Maybe you could clarify? I can't find a way to reconcile it with its parent comment in a way that gives me anything to discuss.

icelancer 13y ago
You seem to have already addressed it in another comment: >Thanks for the link. I would have just gone on confirming my own biases without it. This is incredibly evident in your comments on Dual_EC and sometimes happens on other comments as well. You draw a line in the sand and argue around it constantly, eventually bleeding into passive-aggressive attacks on the knowledge of others. I find it valuable to hear from others outside of my industry (which is not crypto) who have no expertise in that field. They often have a fresh and agnostic look at something. Do you think all these comments slinging mud at you - however inaccurate they may be - were born from nothing?
- tptacek 13y ago
  How about this: why don't you tell me what you think my "line in the sand" is? I bet I don't have that line at all. I have a different explanation for why I always seem to be at odds with people on NSA topics, but I'll wait to provide it.
  - icelancer 13y ago
    >eventually bleeding into passive-aggressive attacks on the knowledge of others. Thanks for proving my point.
  - lawnchair_larry 13y ago
    > I have a different explanation for why I always seem to be at odds with people on NSA topics, but I'll wait to provide it. I'm very interested in that actually. I'm often curious what shapes people's perspectives on these issues, particularly if it doesn't align with any obvious incentives. I always thought that you must have family in law enforcement or something, but I'd love to know the actual reason.
    - tptacek 13y ago
      * NSA topics are heavy on computer security issues and legal issues. * I'm professionally involved in computer security, like you, and have an an amateur interest in the law (I'm considering law school at some point). * Message board nerds have a lot of weird, wrong beliefs about computer security and the law. There is a political difference between me and HN: I'm not an anarcho-capitalist (that silly "world's smallest political test" thingy puts me dead center in "left liberal"). But politics have little to do with where I end up on the NSA threads; it's things like not understanding (or really, having even skimmed) NIST crypto standards, or not taking the time to understand what the 4th Amendment means. The things that get me into "trouble" here have more to do with taking the time to actually read primary sources than anything else. We probably disagree about NSA a lot less than you think we do.
  - chris_wot 13y ago
    I have a different explanation for why I always seem to be at odds with people on NSA topics, but I'll wait to provide it. I hate it when people do that. If you have a position on something, don't leave us all guessing, just state it!